tray menu quit item

[mario-66]

hi,

often i want to open a tray menu, eg for kopete and so i right-click it. but
if i dont release the mousebutton fastly and move the mouse a bit, i hit the
quit menu entry while releasing the mousebutton and kopete quits. this is an
issue for quite all applications with a tray icon. this happens very often
here and its a bit annoying.
i dont know what could be a solution though. perhaps move the quit item or
alter the behaviour with right-click.

greetings mario
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What type of mouse are you using and do you have any disabilities which would
effect fine motor skills such as arthritis, shakes/trembles, or acute RTS?

On Tuesday 03 June 2008 11:04:44 mario wrote:

> hi,
>
> often i want to open a tray menu, eg for kopete and so i right-click it.
> but if i dont release the mousebutton fastly and move the mouse a bit, i
> hit the quit menu entry while releasing the mousebutton and kopete quits.
> this is an issue for quite all applications with a tray icon. this happens
> very often here and its a bit annoying.
> i dont know what could be a solution though. perhaps move the quit item or
> alter the behaviour with right-click.
>
> greetings mario
> _______________________________________________
> kde-usability mailing list
> kde-usability@...
> https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/kde-usability

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[mario-66]

On Tuesday 03 June 2008 17:16:30 Celeste Lyn Paul wrote:
> What type of mouse are you using
um i use a normal 2-button mouse from razer with a mouse wheel. ive set a high
mousesensitivity.

> and do you have any disabilities which
> would effect fine motor skills such as arthritis, shakes/trembles, or acute
> RTS?
no, i dont. im 23 and at good health and normal versatile with the mouse, id
say. a friend of mine told me he had exact the same issue(he also doesnt have
a disabilitiy which could affect his hand), so i decided to post to the list,
otherwise i wouldnt probably.

i just had an idea, my problem is the menu appears directly at the mouse
cursor, perhaps it would help to shift it like 10 px over the cursor.

thanks!

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Hi Celeste,

I can recall having the same problem often.
But, I can't get the effect when _trying_. I suppose this becomes a
problem mostly when an app's context menu is taking too long to show
up (coming from swap, etc...) and the user moves the mouse in the
meantime (without releasing).

If that's true then the solution is purely technical: a mouseclick
initiated on widget A shouldn't carry over to any widget B that is
created later.

Maybe you can do usability testing to make heads of tails of the problem.

On Tuesday 03 June 2008 18:16:30 Celeste Lyn Paul wrote:
> What type of mouse are you using and do you have any disabilities which
> would effect fine motor skills such as arthritis, shakes/trembles, or acute
> RTS?
I'm healthy as well. The problem has occured with both laser and ball mice.

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I had this happen to me as well.
Triggering would involve right clicking one of the tray icons, deciding to do
something else instead and move away and release the mouse button at the same
time (yeah, humans are just too slow and imprecise).
This way the mouse release event can happen over the menu which tends to have
quit as lowest item.

Regards,
Frederik

On Wednesday 04 June 2008 11:24:25 Stefan Monov wrote:

> Hi Celeste,
>
> I can recall having the same problem often.
> But, I can't get the effect when _trying_. I suppose this becomes a
> problem mostly when an app's context menu is taking too long to show
> up (coming from swap, etc...) and the user moves the mouse in the
> meantime (without releasing).
>
> If that's true then the solution is purely technical: a mouseclick
> initiated on widget A shouldn't carry over to any widget B that is
> created later.
>
> Maybe you can do usability testing to make heads of tails of the problem.
>
> On Tuesday 03 June 2008 18:16:30 Celeste Lyn Paul wrote:
> > What type of mouse are you using and do you have any disabilities which
> > would effect fine motor skills such as arthritis, shakes/trembles, or
> > acute RTS?
>
> I'm healthy as well. The problem has occured with both laser and ball mice.

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On Tuesday 03 June 2008 17:04:44 mario wrote:
> hi,
>
> often i want to open a tray menu, eg for kopete and so i right-click it.
> but if i dont release the mousebutton fastly and move the mouse a bit, i
> hit the quit menu entry while releasing the mousebutton and kopete quits.
> this is an issue for quite all applications with a tray icon. this happens
> very often here and its a bit annoying.
> i dont know what could be a solution though. perhaps move the quit item or
> alter the behaviour with right-click.

Klipper had that problem as well, and I think it was solved with a simple
timeout.

Personally, I thought then and I still think that this should be solved at the
kdelibs level so that every application with a quit button in the context
menu guards against this case.

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Hmm.. are both of you using high resolutions and small default fonts?  Mario
also mentioned the high mouse sensitivity, and that combined with a smaller
target could produce a small-target problem.

On Wednesday 04 June 2008 05:24:25 Stefan Monov wrote:

> Hi Celeste,
>
> I can recall having the same problem often.
> But, I can't get the effect when _trying_. I suppose this becomes a
> problem mostly when an app's context menu is taking too long to show
> up (coming from swap, etc...) and the user moves the mouse in the
> meantime (without releasing).
>
> If that's true then the solution is purely technical: a mouseclick
> initiated on widget A shouldn't carry over to any widget B that is
> created later.
>
> Maybe you can do usability testing to make heads of tails of the problem.
>
> On Tuesday 03 June 2008 18:16:30 Celeste Lyn Paul wrote:
> > What type of mouse are you using and do you have any disabilities which
> > would effect fine motor skills such as arthritis, shakes/trembles, or
> > acute RTS?
>
> I'm healthy as well. The problem has occured with both laser and ball mice.

--
Celeste Lyn Paul
celeste@...
KDE Usability Project
usability.kde.org
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[mario-66]

On Wednesday 04 June 2008 15:24:10 Celeste Lyn Paul wrote:
> Hmm.. are both of you using high resolutions and small default fonts?
> Mario also mentioned the high mouse sensitivity, and that combined with a
> smaller target could produce a small-target problem.
i have 1600x1200 resolution running, my trayicons are 16x16px. font size is 8.
i dont know if the issue is less severe with bigger fonts or trayicons,
because it happens even if you move the mouse 1px up/left before releasing
it.

greetings mario
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On Wednesdayen den 4 June 2008 17:17:32 mario wrote:

> On Wednesday 04 June 2008 15:24:10 Celeste Lyn Paul wrote:
> > Hmm.. are both of you using high resolutions and small default fonts?
> > Mario also mentioned the high mouse sensitivity, and that combined with a
> > smaller target could produce a small-target problem.
>
> i have 1600x1200 resolution running, my trayicons are 16x16px. font size is
> 8. i dont know if the issue is less severe with bigger fonts or trayicons,
> because it happens even if you move the mouse 1px up/left before releasing
> it.
>

The problem can be reproduced by clicking (immediately releasing) the right
mouse button while slowly moving the mouse up over the trayicon.

Tested with at least Krandrtray, KMix, Juk, and KMail (on KDE 3.5.9).

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[Pino Toscano]

Alle mercoledì 04 giugno 2008, Esben Mose Hansen ha scritto:
> Personally, I thought then and I still think that this should be solved at
> the kdelibs level so that every application with a quit button in the
> context menu guards against this case.

Speaking of solutions at kdelibs level and Klipper, I'd like to have
the "smart popup placement" done by klipper available in kdelibs.
(And, IMHO, it would solve a bit the "quit menu item" issue, as the popup
would not appear over the icon, and thus not under the mouse cursor.)

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On Tuesday 03 June 2008, mario wrote:
> i dont know what could be a solution though. perhaps move the quit item or
> alter the behaviour with right-click.

hm. i'm surprised this behaviour has shown itself again.

several years ago i added a little confirmation dialog to the quit-from-system-
tray entry in the standard systray icon context menu. this completely stopped
the bug reports from appearing that used to come in quite regularly then.

why you aren't getting this dialog is beyond me. i'm getting them here for
both kde3 and kde4 apps.

did you perhaps click "don't ask me again" at some point in time?

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On Wednesday 04 June 2008, Pino Toscano wrote:
> Alle mercoledì 04 giugno 2008, Esben Mose Hansen ha scritto:
> > Personally, I thought then and I still think that this should be solved
> > at the kdelibs level so that every application with a quit button in the
> > context menu guards against this case.
>
> Speaking of solutions at kdelibs level and Klipper, I'd like to have
> the "smart popup placement" done by klipper available in kdelibs.

wait .. so klipper has a move-the-menu-to-a-nice-place code, but it has never
been moved into KSystemTrayIcon? .. arg.

Esben: could you point me to the relevant code so i can whip up a patch?

--
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humru othro a kohnu se
GPG Fingerprint: 8B8B 2209 0C6F 7C47 B1EA  EE75 D6B7 2EB1 A7F1 DB43

KDE core developer sponsored by Trolltech



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[mario-66]

On Wednesday 04 June 2008 22:14:48 Aaron J. Seigo wrote:
> several years ago i added a little confirmation dialog to the
> quit-from-system- tray entry in the standard systray icon context menu.

yes, sorry i didnt mention that, of course the box appears. (oh with kopete it
doesnt..) no worries :)
but that only fixes the symptom, i find it still annoying to have to close the
box then with "no i didnt want to close the program". for other people it
might be ok though, so decide whats best. :=)

thanks for your effort!





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On 6/4/08, mario <kdeusability@...> wrote:

> On Wednesday 04 June 2008 22:14:48 Aaron J. Seigo wrote:
>> several years ago i added a little confirmation dialog to the
>> quit-from-system- tray entry in the standard systray icon context menu.
>
> yes, sorry i didnt mention that, of course the box appears. (oh with kopete
> it
> doesnt..) no worries :)
> but that only fixes the symptom, i find it still annoying to have to close
> the
> box then with "no i didnt want to close the program". for other people it
> might be ok though, so decide whats best. :=)

Yeah, not OK for me, I hate those boxes. It's so annoying to have to
CONFIRM you want to close something if you choose 'quit', it's insane.
A smarter solution would be very much appreciated ;-)

> thanks for your effort!
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On Wednesday 04 June 2008 22:17:21 Aaron J. Seigo wrote:
                         ^^^

sorry about the delay! I blame my nation's constitution day :)

> wait .. so klipper has a move-the-menu-to-a-nice-place code, but it has
> never been moved into KSystemTrayIcon? .. arg.
>
> Esben: could you point me to the relevant code so i can whip up a patch?

Of course. I'ts in klipper.cpp, in void Klipper::showPopupMenu( QMenu *menu ).
Relevant bit is

        if( KSystemTrayIcon* tray = dynamic_cast< KSystemTrayIcon* >(
parent())) {
            QRect g = tray->geometry();
            QRect screen = KGlobalSettings::desktopGeometry(g.center());

            if ( g.x()-screen.x() > screen.width()/2 &&
                 g.y()-screen.y() + size.height() > screen.height() )
                menu->popup(QPoint( g.x(), g.y() - size.height()));
            else
                menu->popup(QPoint( g.x() + g.width(), g.y() + g.height()));
        } else
            abort();

Funny, but I've never noticed that Klipper does something better here :}

It might not do the right thing in case of multiple screens, though. It also
has some code to popup at mouse pointer, not sure if anyone prefers this.

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[mikelima]

I think this all should be fixed at the right level, instead of adding
workarounds to workarounds:

The real problem is that the first time the menu pops up, Qt does not
position it at the right place. I have a kde 3.5 here, but I guess
this has not changed...

To see this, you can click on a tray icon: if it is the first time in
the desktop session you click on it, the menu size is computed
incorrectly, so the menu pops up in a different position from
subsequent clicks.

So on the first click the quit item is likely to pop up directly under
the mouse pointer...

This is a general problem, it affects all widgets actually, but it's
really annoying with menus.

Luciano

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