test build for automation moving

[Steven Yi]

Hi All,

I've placed a test build at:

http://www.kunstmusik.com/blue_0.123.0_beta_installer.jar
http://www.kunstmusik.com/blue_0.123.0_beta.zip

This build has the work I did today which contains the first ability
to select an area, drag, and move line points.  The implementation is
for single line mode.  To use, while in single-line mode, hold down
shift, mouse down, then drag to create the marquee.  After release,
mouse over the selection area and press down, drag, and release to
move the points.

I am curious for feedback on this feature.  One, currently, the
selection is set to not snap to any line points or time values.
Dragging the region includes any non-point space, so those non-point
spaces may actually clear out other areas when dragged.  I had seen in
another program (perhaps Cakewalk Sonar?) where the selection would
highlight points but be limited to the location of the first and last
point.  Dragging then would be bound to those areas and not if you
happen to select pixels before and after.  I am not sure which one I
prefer, though am open to hear comments on it.

Otherwise, this feature also has it so that when you drag, it'll act
like an overwrite of data, but the drag isn't committed until you
release the mouse. So if you drag a selection area over some points,
you can see those points disappear then reappear when you drag out
from that area.

Single-line mode is only one part of the bigger issue of selection and
modification.  I'll be looking at working on multi-line mode next,
where it will be a full "anything in the selection area" gets moved,
which is all points in any lines and any soundObjects. The other
things I am thinking about are:

-left-right keys - push points and soundObjects left or right one
pixel's worth of time, depending on mode
-push right option - menu popup option, shows entry dialog for num
beats to push over all material to right of where mouse clicked.
-move automation with soundObject option - if moving a soundObj, have
automation automatically move too (would be in the score mode)
-changing the big "Score", "Single Line" and "Multi Line" buttons to
be icons instead of text (always meant to but never got around to
creating icons; if someone is skilled with graphics and wants to
contribute icons, please contact me)
-need to consider other line segment types other than linear (can
anyone mention what other line types of they have seen in other
programs?)


Just to note, I'm finding in looking at different programs that there
seems to be different methods taken by different tools on how to do
automation selection and handling.  I'd really like to think through
the problem and come up with the one that is going to be the most
efficient and natural to use.  So if you have an opinion on this
please feel free to chime in.  I'm sure we'll all have different
opinions, but I'm interested to hear all the ideas and to try to come
up with a good solution.

Any feedback very much appreciated!
Thanks,
steven

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[menno]

this is a test

[Atte]

Steven Yi wrote:

> I am curious for feedback on this feature.

I'll try to play a bit with it tomorrow and give you some feedback.

--
peace, love & harmony
Atte

http://atte.dk       | http://myspace.com/attejensen
http://anagrammer.dk | http://modlys.dk

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[Atte]

Steven Yi wrote:

> This build has the work I did today which contains the first ability
> to select an area, drag, and move line points.  The implementation is
> for single line mode.

I tried this out and it seems to work great!

One thing: I see the white selection is snapping, but the moved points
are not. Isn't the points supposed to snap also?

--
peace, love & harmony
Atte

http://atte.dk       | http://myspace.com/attejensen
http://anagrammer.dk | http://modlys.dk

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[Steven Yi]

Hi All,

Thanks Menno and Atte for responding on the test build!  I did not
test out snapping of points so will take a look at that now.  Thanks
for reporting that!

steven


On Thu, Mar 20, 2008 at 12:15 PM, Atte André Jensen
<atte.jensen@...> wrote:

> Steven Yi wrote:
>
>  > This build has the work I did today which contains the first ability
>  > to select an area, drag, and move line points.  The implementation is
>  > for single line mode.
>
>  I tried this out and it seems to work great!
>
>  One thing: I see the white selection is snapping, but the moved points
>  are not. Isn't the points supposed to snap also?
>
>
>
>  --
>  peace, love & harmony
>  Atte
>
>  http://atte.dk       | http://myspace.com/attejensen
>  http://anagrammer.dk | http://modlys.dk
>
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>  Bluemusic-users@...
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>

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[Steven Yi]

Hi All,

I think the editing is now fixed for snap.  I have checked in code
into CVS and have updated the files here:

http://www.kunstmusik.com/blue_0.123.0_beta_installer.jar
http://www.kunstmusik.com/blue_0.123.0_beta.zip

Thanks!
steven


On Thu, Mar 20, 2008 at 7:09 PM, Steven Yi <stevenyi@...> wrote:

> Hi All,
>
>  Thanks Menno and Atte for responding on the test build!  I did not
>  test out snapping of points so will take a look at that now.  Thanks
>  for reporting that!
>
>  steven
>
>
>
>
>  On Thu, Mar 20, 2008 at 12:15 PM, Atte André Jensen
>  <atte.jensen@...> wrote:
>  > Steven Yi wrote:
>  >
>  >  > This build has the work I did today which contains the first ability
>  >  > to select an area, drag, and move line points.  The implementation is
>  >  > for single line mode.
>  >
>  >  I tried this out and it seems to work great!
>  >
>  >  One thing: I see the white selection is snapping, but the moved points
>  >  are not. Isn't the points supposed to snap also?
>  >
>  >
>  >
>  >  --
>  >  peace, love & harmony
>  >  Atte
>  >
>  >  http://atte.dk       | http://myspace.com/attejensen
>  >  http://anagrammer.dk | http://modlys.dk
>  >
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>

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[Atte]

Steven Yi wrote:

> I think the editing is now fixed for snap.  I have checked in code
> into CVS and have updated the files here:

That seems to work great, thanks!

How about copying? I find I'm often "playing" the automation, and so it
would be nice to copy the automation from one section to another...

--
peace, love & harmony
Atte

http://atte.dk       | http://myspace.com/attejensen
http://anagrammer.dk | http://modlys.dk

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[Steven Yi]

Hi All,

I've added selection and moving of soundObjects in multi-line mode,
which completes the original functional requirements I set out for the
modes.  There is still something to figure out about moving
soundObjects and having any automations on the same layer move too,
but may need to think about how to enable/disable that and how to
implement.  As for copying/pasting, how would you suggest that to work
in terms of user interface?  Should it be like in the score mode where
you ctrl-click it pastes, except it has to paste in the same layer, so
it would just look at time of where clicked and disregard layer of
where clicked?

The updated mult-line mode changes are in CVS as well as the test
builds from my site:

http://www.kunstmusik.com/blue_0.123.0_beta_installer.jar
http://www.kunstmusik.com/blue_0.123.0_beta.zip

Thanks!
steven


On Sat, Mar 22, 2008 at 8:05 AM, Atte André Jensen
<atte.jensen@...> wrote:

> Steven Yi wrote:
>
>  > I think the editing is now fixed for snap.  I have checked in code
>  > into CVS and have updated the files here:
>
>  That seems to work great, thanks!
>
>  How about copying? I find I'm often "playing" the automation, and so it
>  would be nice to copy the automation from one section to another...
>
>  --
>
>
> peace, love & harmony
>  Atte
>
>  http://atte.dk       | http://myspace.com/attejensen
>  http://anagrammer.dk | http://modlys.dk
>
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>  This SF.net email is sponsored by: Microsoft
>  Defy all challenges. Microsoft(R) Visual Studio 2008.
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>  Bluemusic-users mailing list
>  Bluemusic-users@...
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>

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[Atte]

Steven Yi wrote:

> As for copying/pasting, how would you suggest that to work
> in terms of user interface?  Should it be like in the score mode where
> you ctrl-click it pastes, except it has to paste in the same layer, so
> it would just look at time of where clicked and disregard layer of
> where clicked?

How about: holding control while "moving points" would actually not move
but copy? So a simple extension to the way moving works...

--
peace, love & harmony
Atte

http://atte.dk       | http://myspace.com/attejensen
http://anagrammer.dk | http://modlys.dk

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[Rob Canning]

Steven Yi wrote:
> As for copying/pasting, how would you suggest that to work

The ability to delete multiple points would be handy too - cut i guess.
Also would be nice to be able to move points up and down as well as left and right.
Other line segment types could be random walk - i remember something like this in cecilia., how about logarithmic, gaussian curves etc.?

In the line point editor it would be nice if the numbers were automatically selected so one could just use the arrow keys and a number to change multiple values quickly ie without the need to double click each entry - too much mouse keyboard mouse keyboard action atm.

Perhaps off topic but how about a horizontal grid too? with the ability to snap to points along the Y axis.
It would be nice for example in the frequency domain to be able to have a choice of grid lines per Xhz for example or tones semitones quartertones - or markers per user defined scale... just a thought.

Thanks,
Rob