iTunes just ate a bunch of my unreleased music

[frey]

this is a heads-up for anyone using iTunes to preview/playback their
unreleased music:  my copy (iTunes 7.5/OSX Intel) just ate a bunch of
really nice music that i'd made (aiff files) that i have no way of getting
back.

obviously i'm not very happy about this at all, as i didn't have backups.

this isn't the first time i've noticed iTunes deleting files, but it is the
first time i've noticed it deleting files that i was referencing elsewhere
on the harddrive, rather than in its structured iTunes Library folder.

you have been warned.

--
damian stewart | [phone] |  damian@...
frey | live art with machines | http://www.frey.co.nz

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[David Maier-2]

That's interesting.  I just got a MacBook (iTunes 7.6/OSX 10.5 Intel),  
and I noticed files disappearing from iTunes – but the files  
themselves are still where they always were.  So don't panic if they  
don't show up in iTunes – they may still be there.  Still (repeat  
after me): back up frequently!  (or get a Time Capsule!)

D.

On Jun 29, 2008, at 7:48 AM, Damian Stewart wrote:

> this is a heads-up for anyone using iTunes to preview/playback their  
> unreleased music:  my copy (iTunes 7.5/OSX Intel) just ate a bunch  
> of really nice music that i'd made (aiff files) that i have no way  
> of getting back.
>
> obviously i'm not very happy about this at all, as i didn't have  
> backups.
>
> this isn't the first time i've noticed iTunes deleting files, but it  
> is the first time i've noticed it deleting files that i was  
> referencing elsewhere on the harddrive, rather than in its  
> structured iTunes Library folder.
>
> you have been warned.
>
> --
> damian stewart | [phone] |  damian@...
> frey | live art with machines | http://www.frey.co.nz

[joel justice]

Along the lines of backing up, I have found Time Machine to be  
fantastic for going back in time to different states of groups of  
musical projects. I do a quick Time Machine backup before and after  
every recording/editing session - and sometimes during... Very easy  
and fast.

jj

Sent from iPhone


On Jun 29, 2008, at 10:25 AM, David Maier <dfm888@...> wrote:

> That's interesting.  I just got a MacBook (iTunes 7.6/OSX 10.5  
> Intel), and I noticed files disappearing from iTunes – but the files
>  themselves are still where they always were.  So don't panic if the
> y don't show up in iTunes – they may still be there.  Still (repeat  
> after me): back up frequently!  (or get a Time Capsule!)
>
> D.
>
> On Jun 29, 2008, at 7:48 AM, Damian Stewart wrote:
>
>> this is a heads-up for anyone using iTunes to preview/playback  
>> their unreleased music:  my copy (iTunes 7.5/OSX Intel) just ate a  
>> bunch of really nice music that i'd made (aiff files) that i have  
>> no way of getting back.
>>
>> obviously i'm not very happy about this at all, as i didn't have  
>> backups.
>>
>> this isn't the first time i've noticed iTunes deleting files, but  
>> it is the first time i've noticed it deleting files that i was  
>> referencing elsewhere on the harddrive, rather than in its  
>> structured iTunes Library folder.
>>
>> you have been warned.
>>
>> --
>> damian stewart | [phone] |  damian@...
>> frey | live art with machines | http://www.frey.co.nz
>

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[Jon-10]

"Sent from iPhone"... haha.  Apple geek. :)



On 30/06/2008, at 4:38 AM, Joel Justice wrote:

> Along the lines of backing up, I have found Time Machine to be  
> fantastic for going back in time to different states of groups of  
> musical projects. I do a quick Time Machine backup before and after  
> every recording/editing session - and sometimes during... Very easy  
> and fast.
>
> jj
>
> Sent from iPhone
>
>
> On Jun 29, 2008, at 10:25 AM, David Maier <dfm888@...>  
> wrote:
>
>> That's interesting.  I just got a MacBook (iTunes 7.6/OSX 10.5  
>> Intel), and I noticed files disappearing from iTunes – but the  
>> files themselves are still where they always were.  So don't panic  
>> if they don't show up in iTunes – they may still be there.  Still  
>> (repeat after me): back up frequently!  (or get a Time Capsule!)
>>
>> D.
>>

---
dizzydonor.org

[joel justice]

I love this little phone man. Heck, it allows me to stay on top of  
microsound on the go ;-)  I use the hell out of it.

Sent from iPhone

On Jun 29, 2008, at 2:24 PM, jon ++ <seedling@...> wrote:

> "Sent from iPhone"... haha.  Apple geek. :)
>
>
>
> On 30/06/2008, at 4:38 AM, Joel Justice wrote:
>
>> Along the lines of backing up, I have found Time Machine to be  
>> fantastic for going back in time to different states of groups of  
>> musical projects. I do a quick Time Machine backup before and after  
>> every recording/editing session - and sometimes during... Very easy  
>> and fast.
>>
>> jj
>>
>> Sent from iPhone
>>
>>
>> On Jun 29, 2008, at 10:25 AM, David Maier <dfm888@...>  
>> wrote:
>>
>>> That's interesting.  I just got a MacBook (iTunes 7.6/OSX 10.5  
>>> Intel), and I noticed files disappearing from iTunes – but the f
>>> iles themselves are still where they always were.  So don't pani
>>> c if they don't show up in iTunes – they may still be there.  St
>>> ill (repeat after me): back up frequently!  (or get a Time Capsule!)
>>>
>>> D.
>>>
>
>
> ---
> dizzydonor.org

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["marc_mcnulty (mærðnír)"]

Hello all,

        There are some very extreme bugs within iTunes when dealing with
.aif(f) or .wav files.  The problem is that iTunes runs its DRM filter
on all files to see if they are "burned from an cd or bought from
iTunes"; the issues resides in that their DRM filters breaks direct
links to files, then they will not show up in iTunes, the files more
than likely still exist.  It would be to your and all artists benefit to
not use iTunes as a tool for working on serious projects, it is only a
consumer tool meant to purposely limit the content that the end-user can
store and play.

All the best,
Marc


--
marc mcnulty [mærðnír] -> sound@...

works -> http://www.earphone.org
sound art -> http://www.artsound.org





David Maier wrote:

> That's interesting.  I just got a MacBook (iTunes 7.6/OSX 10.5 Intel),
> and I noticed files disappearing from iTunes – but the files themselves
> are still where they always were.  So don't panic if they don't show up
> in iTunes – they may still be there.  Still (repeat after me): back up
> frequently!  (or get a Time Capsule!)
>
> D.
>
> On Jun 29, 2008, at 7:48 AM, Damian Stewart wrote:
>
>> this is a heads-up for anyone using iTunes to preview/playback their
>> unreleased music:  my copy (iTunes 7.5/OSX Intel) just ate a bunch of
>> really nice music that i'd made (aiff files) that i have no way of
>> getting back.
>>
>> obviously i'm not very happy about this at all, as i didn't have backups.
>>
>> this isn't the first time i've noticed iTunes deleting files, but it
>> is the first time i've noticed it deleting files that i was
>> referencing elsewhere on the harddrive, rather than in its structured
>> iTunes Library folder.
>>
>> you have been warned.
>>
>> --
>> damian stewart | [phone] |  damian@...
>> frey | live art with machines | http://www.frey.co.nz
>
>

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[Jared Friend]

I would love to see some documentation on a "DRM filter" in Itunes. I've
never heard of anything like that, and a quick google search doesn't bring
up anything.

I've never had any problems with the very large number of AIFF and WAV files
I have. Chances are (in my experience) it's actually the Itunes file
management settings...  I've had a number of acquantances complain that
stuff in Itunes goes missing (files or links), and the cause was generally
how their files were organized and how that conflicted with the settings
they had chosen in Itunes.

I'm curious about the DRM filter though, because I know about the DRM that
is present on Itunes purchased tracks, but I didn't think there were any
consequences to having non-DRM files in your Itunes library (and my very
large library of non-Itunes purchased tracks has never suffered any losses
that I've noticed as a result of something like this).

Jared

On Sun, Jun 29, 2008 at 6:37 PM, "marc_mcnulty (mærðnír)" <
sound@...> wrote:

> Hello all,
>
>        There are some very extreme bugs within iTunes when dealing with
> .aif(f) or .wav files.  The problem is that iTunes runs its DRM filter on
> all files to see if they are "burned from an cd or bought from iTunes"; the
> issues resides in that their DRM filters breaks direct links to files, then
> they will not show up in iTunes, the files more than likely still exist.  It
> would be to your and all artists benefit to not use iTunes as a tool for
> working on serious projects, it is only a consumer tool meant to purposely
> limit the content that the end-user can store and play.
>
> All the best,
> Marc
>
>
> --
> marc mcnulty [mærðnír] -> sound@...
>
> works -> http://www.earphone.org
> sound art -> http://www.artsound.org
>
>
>
>
>
>
> David Maier wrote:
>
>> That's interesting.  I just got a MacBook (iTunes 7.6/OSX 10.5 Intel), and
>> I noticed files disappearing from iTunes – but the files themselves are
>> still where they always were.  So don't panic if they don't show up in
>> iTunes – they may still be there.  Still (repeat after me): back up
>> frequently!  (or get a Time Capsule!)
>>
>> D.
>>
>> On Jun 29, 2008, at 7:48 AM, Damian Stewart wrote:
>>
>>  this is a heads-up for anyone using iTunes to preview/playback their
>>> unreleased music:  my copy (iTunes 7.5/OSX Intel) just ate a bunch of really
>>> nice music that i'd made (aiff files) that i have no way of getting back.
>>>
>>> obviously i'm not very happy about this at all, as i didn't have backups.
>>>
>>> this isn't the first time i've noticed iTunes deleting files, but it is
>>> the first time i've noticed it deleting files that i was referencing
>>> elsewhere on the harddrive, rather than in its structured iTunes Library
>>> folder.
>>>
>>> you have been warned.
>>>
>>> --
>>> damian stewart | [phone] |  damian@...
>>> frey | live art with machines | http://www.frey.co.nz
>>>
>>
>>
>>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: microsound-unsubscribe@...
> For additional commands, e-mail: microsound-help@...
> website: http://www.microsound.org
>
>

[frey]

marc_mcnulty (mærðnír) wrote:

> ... the files more than likely still exist.

no, in my case the files are *gone*. i've thoroughly searched and cannot
find them anywhere.

 > It would be to your and all artists benefit to
 > not use iTunes as a tool for working on serious projects, it is only a
 > consumer tool meant to purposely limit the content that the end-user can
 > store and play.

can anyone recommend an audio player on OSX for this purpose?

--
damian stewart | [phone] |  damian@...
frey | live art with machines | http://www.frey.co.nz

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[Jared Friend]

>
>
> can anyone recommend an audio player on OSX for this purpose?
>
>
I use Cog quite frequently and love it.

jared

["marc_mcnulty (mærðnír)"]

Hi,

You may need to lookup FairPlay DRM, is what Apple uses.  The problem
seems to happen when iTunes is launched, it parses its database looking
for new or changed files.  If for example you have copied some DRM'd
files from one machine to another and they are not authorized several
odd things can happen; for some reason .aif(f) or .wav files can get
unlinked in this process.  I have not had the deletion problem, but I do
think it's possible.

I also like the 'cog' app, it's simple and handles many more file formats.

Cheers,
Marc

Jared Friend wrote:

> I would love to see some documentation on a "DRM filter" in Itunes. I've
> never heard of anything like that, and a quick google search doesn't bring
> up anything.
>
> I've never had any problems with the very large number of AIFF and WAV files
> I have. Chances are (in my experience) it's actually the Itunes file
> management settings...  I've had a number of acquantances complain that
> stuff in Itunes goes missing (files or links), and the cause was generally
> how their files were organized and how that conflicted with the settings
> they had chosen in Itunes.
>
> I'm curious about the DRM filter though, because I know about the DRM that
> is present on Itunes purchased tracks, but I didn't think there were any
> consequences to having non-DRM files in your Itunes library (and my very
> large library of non-Itunes purchased tracks has never suffered any losses
> that I've noticed as a result of something like this).
>
> Jared
>
> On Sun, Jun 29, 2008 at 6:37 PM, "marc_mcnulty (mærðnír)" <
> sound@...> wrote:
>
>> Hello all,
>>
>>        There are some very extreme bugs within iTunes when dealing with
>> .aif(f) or .wav files.  The problem is that iTunes runs its DRM filter on
>> all files to see if they are "burned from an cd or bought from iTunes"; the
>> issues resides in that their DRM filters breaks direct links to files, then
>> they will not show up in iTunes, the files more than likely still exist.  It
>> would be to your and all artists benefit to not use iTunes as a tool for
>> working on serious projects, it is only a consumer tool meant to purposely
>> limit the content that the end-user can store and play.
>>
>> All the best,
>> Marc
>>
>>
>> --
>> marc mcnulty [mærðnír] -> sound@...
>>
>> works -> http://www.earphone.org
>> sound art -> http://www.artsound.org
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> David Maier wrote:
>>
>>> That's interesting.  I just got a MacBook (iTunes 7.6/OSX 10.5 Intel), and
>>> I noticed files disappearing from iTunes – but the files themselves are
>>> still where they always were.  So don't panic if they don't show up in
>>> iTunes – they may still be there.  Still (repeat after me): back up
>>> frequently!  (or get a Time Capsule!)
>>>
>>> D.
>>>
>>> On Jun 29, 2008, at 7:48 AM, Damian Stewart wrote:
>>>
>>>  this is a heads-up for anyone using iTunes to preview/playback their
>>>> unreleased music:  my copy (iTunes 7.5/OSX Intel) just ate a bunch of really
>>>> nice music that i'd made (aiff files) that i have no way of getting back.
>>>>
>>>> obviously i'm not very happy about this at all, as i didn't have backups.
>>>>
>>>> this isn't the first time i've noticed iTunes deleting files, but it is
>>>> the first time i've noticed it deleting files that i was referencing
>>>> elsewhere on the harddrive, rather than in its structured iTunes Library
>>>> folder.
>>>>
>>>> you have been warned.
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> damian stewart | [phone] |  damian@...
>>>> frey | live art with machines | http://www.frey.co.nz
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: microsound-unsubscribe@...
>> For additional commands, e-mail: microsound-help@...
>> website: http://www.microsound.org
>>
>>
>

--
marc mcnulty [mærðnír] -> sound@...

works -> http://www.earphone.org
sound art -> http://www.artsound.org




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[Noah Paessel]

On Jun 30, 2008, at 3:50 AM, Damian Stewart wrote:

>
> can anyone recommend an audio player on OSX for this purpose?
>

When iTunes annoys me with its myopic dogma, I use Audion.  It was  
once commercial software from Panic Software, but is now free (I  
think).   Audion is lightweight and cute.

Songbird, though not small or cute, is free and open source.  
Unfortunately it looks and feels like iTunes. Though I don't think it  
insists on moving files around.

Best,

- noah





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[frey]

marc_mcnulty (mærðnír) wrote:
> Hi,
>
> You may need to lookup FairPlay DRM, is what Apple uses.  The problem
> seems to happen when iTunes is launched, it parses its database looking
> for new or changed files.  If for example you have copied some DRM'd
> files from one machine to another and they are not authorized several
> odd things can happen; for some reason .aif(f) or .wav files can get
> unlinked in this process.  I have not had the deletion problem, but I do
> think it's possible.

i don't think this is what got me. the files were there, i group-edited
them to change the artist (to me), and as soon as i pressed enter they
disappeared from the playlist, disappeared from my ~/Music folder,
disappeared from my harddrive completely, gone.

--
damian stewart | [phone] |  damian@...
frey | live art with machines | http://www.frey.co.nz

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[craquemattic]

Make sure you deselect the option to have itunes keep your library
organized.

I never use iTunes to catalog my important sound files, it's really just
an mp3 player for me.

Damian Stewart wrote:

> this is a heads-up for anyone using iTunes to preview/playback their
> unreleased music:  my copy (iTunes 7.5/OSX Intel) just ate a bunch of
> really nice music that i'd made (aiff files) that i have no way of
> getting back.
>
> obviously i'm not very happy about this at all, as i didn't have backups.
>
> this isn't the first time i've noticed iTunes deleting files, but it is
> the first time i've noticed it deleting files that i was referencing
> elsewhere on the harddrive, rather than in its structured iTunes Library
> folder.
>
> you have been warned.
>

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[bryan garcia]

two moar cents

i wonder if you may have had your ipod or any other portable device hooked up to your machine.   it sometimes happens that itunes gets confused and moves some files around, when you didn't actually want it to.   though i imagine you've already looked everywhere.    

another possibility, if you don't have time machine, and cant revert,
is to look at your itunes archived library.   you'll need to go to help menu, but what i've been doing to conserve space is deleting the history of archived libraries, and you can revert to one of your old ones if you don't delete them as i do.

i do group editing as well, and there  is the auto complete function that suggests artist name as you are typing.   i wonder if instead of labeling the songs as you wanted,  it chose one of the auto complete titles, in which case your music might have gotten mislabeled and is now sorted as "mili vanilli, or rick astley or something.   check all the band names associated with what you were tentatively titling your music.

sounds like user error to me.

best regards,

b




--- On Mon, 6/30/08, Damian Stewart <damian@...> wrote:

> From: Damian Stewart <damian@...>
> Subject: Re: [microsound] iTunes just ate a bunch of my unreleased music
> To: "microsound" <microsound@...>
> Date: Monday, June 30, 2008, 7:55 AM
> marc_mcnulty (mærðnír) wrote:
> > Hi,
> >
> > You may need to lookup FairPlay DRM, is what Apple
> uses.  The problem
> > seems to happen when iTunes is launched, it parses its
> database looking
> > for new or changed files.  If for example you have
> copied some DRM'd
> > files from one machine to another and they are not
> authorized several
> > odd things can happen; for some reason .aif(f) or .wav
> files can get
> > unlinked in this process.  I have not had the deletion
> problem, but I do
> > think it's possible.
>
> i don't think this is what got me. the files were
> there, i group-edited
> them to change the artist (to me), and as soon as i pressed
> enter they
> disappeared from the playlist, disappeared from my ~/Music
> folder,
> disappeared from my harddrive completely, gone.
>
> --
> damian stewart | [phone] |  damian@...
> frey | live art with machines | http://www.frey.co.nz
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> To unsubscribe, e-mail:
> microsound-unsubscribe@...
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> website: http://www.microsound.org

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["marc_mcnulty (mærðnír)"]

hi,

these do sound like two very plausible answers.

cheers,
marc

bryan garcia wrote:

> two moar cents
>
> i wonder if you may have had your ipod or any other portable device hooked up to your machine.   it sometimes happens that itunes gets confused and moves some files around, when you didn't actually want it to.   though i imagine you've already looked everywhere.    
>
> another possibility, if you don't have time machine, and cant revert,
> is to look at your itunes archived library.   you'll need to go to help menu, but what i've been doing to conserve space is deleting the history of archived libraries, and you can revert to one of your old ones if you don't delete them as i do.
>
> i do group editing as well, and there  is the auto complete function that suggests artist name as you are typing.   i wonder if instead of labeling the songs as you wanted,  it chose one of the auto complete titles, in which case your music might have gotten mislabeled and is now sorted as "mili vanilli, or rick astley or something.   check all the band names associated with what you were tentatively titling your music.
>
> sounds like user error to me.
>
> best regards,
>
> b
>
>
>
>
> --- On Mon, 6/30/08, Damian Stewart <damian@...> wrote:
>
>> From: Damian Stewart <damian@...>
>> Subject: Re: [microsound] iTunes just ate a bunch of my unreleased music
>> To: "microsound" <microsound@...>
>> Date: Monday, June 30, 2008, 7:55 AM
>> marc_mcnulty (mærðnír) wrote:
>>> Hi,
>>>
>>> You may need to lookup FairPlay DRM, is what Apple
>> uses.  The problem
>>> seems to happen when iTunes is launched, it parses its
>> database looking
>>> for new or changed files.  If for example you have
>> copied some DRM'd
>>> files from one machine to another and they are not
>> authorized several
>>> odd things can happen; for some reason .aif(f) or .wav
>> files can get
>>> unlinked in this process.  I have not had the deletion
>> problem, but I do
>>> think it's possible.
>> i don't think this is what got me. the files were
>> there, i group-edited
>> them to change the artist (to me), and as soon as i pressed
>> enter they
>> disappeared from the playlist, disappeared from my ~/Music
>> folder,
>> disappeared from my harddrive completely, gone.
>>
>> --
>> damian stewart | [phone] |  damian@...
>> frey | live art with machines | http://www.frey.co.nz
>>
>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
>> To unsubscribe, e-mail:
>> microsound-unsubscribe@...
>> For additional commands, e-mail:
>> microsound-help@...
>> website: http://www.microsound.org
>
>
>      
>
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>

--
marc mcnulty [mærðnír] -> sound@...

works -> http://www.earphone.org
sound art -> http://www.artsound.org




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[frey]

bryan garcia wrote:

> though i imagine you've already looked everywhere.

cd /
find . -iname "*.aif*"
find . -iname "*.wav"

found some files, but didn't find the ones i was looking for.

> another possibility, if you don't have time machine, and cant revert, is
> to look at your itunes archived library.   you'll need to go to help
> menu, but what i've been doing to conserve space is deleting the history
> of archived libraries, and you can revert to one of your old ones if you
> don't delete them as i do.

don't know what you're talking about with this one. i'm on 10.4.

> i do group editing as well, and there  is the auto complete function
> that suggests artist name as you are typing.   i wonder if instead of
> labeling the songs as you wanted,  it chose one of the auto complete
> titles, in which case your music might have gotten mislabeled and is now
> sorted as "mili vanilli, or rick astley or something.   check all the
> band names associated with what you were tentatively titling your music.

i just reordered my library by time (the two files i'm most pissed about
were around about 47 and 53 minutes long, respectively). nothing.

> sounds like user error to me.

nope. gone gone gone.

iTunes deletes files.

--
damian stewart | [phone] |  damian@...
frey | live art with machines | http://www.frey.co.nz

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