UTF-8 package

[Sebastian Mendel]

Hi,

would it require much work to make a second package with UTF-8 lang
files only?

saving half the size

and we could see in the download statistics what is prefered/required


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[Marc Delisle]

Sebastian Mendel a écrit :

> Hi,
>
> would it require much work to make a second package with UTF-8 lang
> files only?
>
> saving half the size
>
> and we could see in the download statistics what is prefered/required
>
>

Not much work, it's a good idea. We could advertise this new one as the
"main" one, saying that the one that includes non-UTF-8 lang files is
necessary only with older browsers. Any idea which browsers?

Marc

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[Michael Keck]

Hi,

is there any Browser wich couldn't support UTF-8 charsets? I don't really know.
But the current browsers and IE 5.5. too should support UTF-8.

Another point:
How are you thinking about language packages?
Each language should be installable like we've done with themes.
This will reduce download and package size to ;)

Regards Michael

--- Original Message ---
Mail from: Marc Delisle
Date: 29.09.2006 14:05

Sebastian Mendel a écrit :

Hi,

would it require much work to make a second package with UTF-8 lang
files only?

saving half the size

and we could see in the download statistics what is prefered/required

Not much work, it's a good idea. We could advertise this new one as the 
"main" one, saying that the one that includes non-UTF-8 lang files is 
necessary only with older browsers. Any idea which browsers?

Marc

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[Jürgen Wind]

Michael Keck wrote:

How are you thinking about language packages?
Each language should be installable like we've done with themes.
This will reduce download and package size to ;)

Regards Michael

that's the most desirable solution, also requested in FR trk

[Marc Delisle]

Michael Keck a écrit :
> Hi,
>
> is there any Browser wich couldn't support UTF-8 charsets? I don't
> really know.
> But the current browsers and IE 5.5. too should support UTF-8.
>
> Another point:
> How are you thinking about language packages?
> Each language should be installable like we've done with themes.

I don't know how we could handle this. Only English in the main package
and all other languages into another kit?

A separate download for each language?

We also have to think what the distributors (like XAMPP or the various
Linux distros) will do? They will install all languages anyway? Put two
kits, one containing only English and an additional language pack?

I did not suspect that download size could be an issue nowadays.

Marc

> This will reduce download and package size to ;)
>
> Regards Michael
>
> --- Original Message ---
> Mail from: Marc Delisle
> Date: 29.09.2006 14:05
>> Sebastian Mendel a écrit :
>>> Hi,
>>>
>>> would it require much work to make a second package with UTF-8 lang
>>> files only?
>>>
>>> saving half the size
>>>
>>> and we could see in the download statistics what is prefered/required
>>>
>>>
>>
>> Not much work, it's a good idea. We could advertise this new one as the
>> "main" one, saying that the one that includes non-UTF-8 lang files is
>> necessary only with older browsers. Any idea which browsers?
>>
>> Marc
>>
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>>
>>

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[Jürgen Wind]

Marc Delisle wrote:

I did not suspect that download size could be an issue nowadays.

i pay for every byte :(
at least the snapshots should not contain languages other than english.

[Michael Keck]

Hi,

I think this would be mainly for end users, wich installes PMA on their webspace.
If I only install the needed languages (I delete the not required languages),
PMA is round about 30% smaller ;)

But this was only a suggestion, not a requestet feature or patch ;)

I think too:
For the others like XAMPP, ISP or Linux Distributors I think it would be better
that they've all languages.

--- Original Message ---
Mail from: Marc Delisle
Date: 29.09.2006 18:48

Michael Keck a écrit :

Hi,

is there any Browser wich couldn't support UTF-8 charsets? I don't 
really know.
But the current browsers and IE 5.5. too should support UTF-8.

Another point:
How are you thinking about language packages?
Each language should be installable like we've done with themes.

I don't know how we could handle this. Only English in the main package 
and all other languages into another kit?

A separate download for each language?

We also have to think what the distributors (like XAMPP or the various 
Linux distros) will do? They will install all languages anyway? Put two 
kits, one containing only English and an additional language pack?

I did not suspect that download size could be an issue nowadays.

Marc

This will reduce download and package size to ;)

Regards Michael

--- Original Message ---
Mail from: Marc Delisle
Date: 29.09.2006 14:05

Sebastian Mendel a écrit :

Hi,

would it require much work to make a second package with UTF-8 lang
files only?

saving half the size

and we could see in the download statistics what is prefered/required

Not much work, it's a good idea. We could advertise this new one as the 
"main" one, saying that the one that includes non-UTF-8 lang files is 
necessary only with older browsers. Any idea which browsers?

Marc

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[Marc Delisle]

Michael Keck a écrit :
> Hi,
>
> I think this would be mainly for end users, wich installes PMA on their
> webspace.
> If I only install the needed languages (I delete the not required
> languages),
> PMA is round about 30% smaller ;)
>
> But this was only a suggestion, not a requestet feature or patch ;)

It's not a bad suggestion, I'm just trying to see how to do it.

I guess a German guy would want to download the main kit plus a language
pack containing only German?

Marc

>
> I think too:
> For the others like XAMPP, ISP or Linux Distributors I think it would be
> better
> that they've all languages.
>
> --- Original Message ---
> Mail from: Marc Delisle
> Date: 29.09.2006 18:48
>> Michael Keck a écrit :
>>> Hi,
>>>
>>> is there any Browser wich couldn't support UTF-8 charsets? I don't
>>> really know.
>>> But the current browsers and IE 5.5. too should support UTF-8.
>>>
>>> Another point:
>>> How are you thinking about language packages?
>>> Each language should be installable like we've done with themes.
>>
>> I don't know how we could handle this. Only English in the main package
>> and all other languages into another kit?
>>
>> A separate download for each language?
>>
>> We also have to think what the distributors (like XAMPP or the various
>> Linux distros) will do? They will install all languages anyway? Put two
>> kits, one containing only English and an additional language pack?
>>
>> I did not suspect that download size could be an issue nowadays.
>>
>> Marc
>>
>>> This will reduce download and package size to ;)
>>>
>>> Regards Michael
>>>
>>> --- Original Message ---
>>> Mail from: Marc Delisle
>>> Date: 29.09.2006 14:05
>>>> Sebastian Mendel a écrit :
>>>>> Hi,
>>>>>
>>>>> would it require much work to make a second package with UTF-8 lang
>>>>> files only?
>>>>>
>>>>> saving half the size
>>>>>
>>>>> and we could see in the download statistics what is prefered/required
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>> Not much work, it's a good idea. We could advertise this new one as the
>>>> "main" one, saying that the one that includes non-UTF-8 lang files is
>>>> necessary only with older browsers. Any idea which browsers?
>>>>
>>>> Marc

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[Michael Keck]

--- Original Message ---
Mail from: Marc Delisle
Date: 29.09.2006 19:13

> It's not a bad suggestion, I'm just trying to see how to do it.
>
> I guess a German guy would want to download the main kit plus a language
> pack containing only German?
>
> Marc 
  

Yes  ;) 
But I know, it would be really difficult to support such a thing.

An other thing:
Is it possible, that the collation/charset dropdown may be
configurable - hiding none needed charsets? This may be usefull to.

Sample:
I only need UTF-8 charsets, latin-1 charsets and perhabs ISO-Charsets
for my region.
If I disable the not needed charsets in config.inc.php the dropdown box
will always show all available charsets (the not needed too).
I know, that the charset/collation dropdown box is filled by all available
charsets/collations from the MySQL-Server.
But hidding some not needed may be really usefull.

Michael

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[Sebastian Mendel]

Michael Keck schrieb:

> I only need UTF-8 charsets, latin-1 charsets and perhabs ISO-Charsets
> for my region.

why do you require latin and iso?

what is it good for using another charset?



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[Sebastian Mendel]

Marc Delisle schrieb:

> Michael Keck a écrit :
>> Hi,
>>
>> I think this would be mainly for end users, wich installes PMA on their
>> webspace.
>> If I only install the needed languages (I delete the not required
>> languages),
>> PMA is round about 30% smaller ;)
>>
>> But this was only a suggestion, not a requestet feature or patch ;)
>
> It's not a bad suggestion, I'm just trying to see how to do it.
>
> I guess a German guy would want to download the main kit plus a language
> pack containing only German?

yes, for sure ;-)

so what now?

phpMyAdmin-core (en only
phpMyAdmin-UTF-8 (all lang, UTF-8)
---
phpMyAdmin-langpack (all languages, including non UTF-8 files)
phpMyAdmin-lang-en
phpMyAdmin-lang-de
...


?



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[Michael Keck]

Hi,

I think:

- de: utf8 & non utf8
- fr: utf8 & non utf8
  ...
- all utf8-langs
- all non utf8-langs
- big langpack (for ISP, Distributors like SuSE, XAMPP ...)
  with all languages and charsets (like at the moment)

- pma should be delivered with 'en' as default language.

What you're thinking about this?


--- Original Message ---
Mail from: Sebastian Mendel
Date: 04.10.2006 10:02

Marc Delisle schrieb:

Michael Keck a écrit :

Hi,

I think this would be mainly for end users, wich installes PMA on their
webspace.
If I only install the needed languages (I delete the not required
languages),
PMA is round about 30% smaller ;)

But this was only a suggestion, not a requestet feature or patch ;)

It's not a bad suggestion, I'm just trying to see how to do it.

I guess a German guy would want to download the main kit plus a language
pack containing only German?

yes, for sure ;-)

so what now?

phpMyAdmin-core (en only
phpMyAdmin-UTF-8 (all lang, UTF-8)
---
phpMyAdmin-langpack (all languages, including non UTF-8 files)
phpMyAdmin-lang-en
phpMyAdmin-lang-de
...
?

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[Michal Čihař]

Hi

On Wed, 04 Oct 2006 10:14:01 +0200
Michael Keck <sfnet@...> wrote:

> I think:
>
> - de: utf8 & non utf8
> - fr: utf8 & non utf8
>   ...
> - all utf8-langs
> - all non utf8-langs
> - big langpack (for ISP, Distributors like SuSE, XAMPP ...)
>   with all languages and charsets (like at the moment)
>
> - pma should be delivered with 'en' as default language.
>
> What you're thinking about this?

That will be much more work on release, when we have 50 translations
[*]. I think just few versions would be enough:

- english-utf-8 only
- utf-8 only [this would be default download option]
- full

[*]: Anyway I don't think it makes sense to have language pack for all
languages, especially those that are far from being complete [1].

[1]: http://cihar.com/phpMyAdmin/stats/translations.php?sort=count

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[Marc Delisle]

Sebastian Mendel a écrit :
> Michael Keck schrieb:
>
>> I only need UTF-8 charsets, latin-1 charsets and perhabs ISO-Charsets
>> for my region.
>
> why do you require latin and iso?
>
> what is it good for using another charset?

On pre-MySQL 4.1, if there is no support for recoding, a user might need
non-UTF-8 lang files.

Marc

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[Marc Delisle]

Michal Čihař a écrit :

> Hi
>
> On Wed, 04 Oct 2006 10:14:01 +0200
> Michael Keck <sfnet@...> wrote:
>
>> I think:
>>
>> - de: utf8 & non utf8
>> - fr: utf8 & non utf8
>>   ...
>> - all utf8-langs
>> - all non utf8-langs
>> - big langpack (for ISP, Distributors like SuSE, XAMPP ...)
>>   with all languages and charsets (like at the moment)
>>
>> - pma should be delivered with 'en' as default language.
>>
>> What you're thinking about this?
>
> That will be much more work on release, when we have 50 translations
> [*]. I think just few versions would be enough:
>
> - english-utf-8 only

I would prefer "english only" with all the English charsets, to be
compatible with pre-MySQL 4.1 machines if they don't have recoding support.

> - utf-8 only [this would be default download option]
ok

> - full
ok

Michal, do you mean that PMA would be included in all these, not just
the language files?

>
> [*]: Anyway I don't think it makes sense to have language pack for all
> languages, especially those that are far from being complete [1].
>
> [1]: http://cihar.com/phpMyAdmin/stats/translations.php?sort=count


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[Michal Čihař]

Hi

On Thu, 05 Oct 2006 07:55:45 -0400
Marc Delisle <Marc.Delisle@...> wrote:

> I would prefer "english only" with all the English charsets, to be
> compatible with pre-MySQL 4.1 machines if they don't have recoding support.

Are there enough such machines?

> Michal, do you mean that PMA would be included in all these, not just
> the language files?

Yes

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[Sebastian Mendel]

Marc Delisle schrieb:

>> - english-utf-8 only
>
> I would prefer "english only" with all the English charsets, to be
> compatible with pre-MySQL 4.1 machines if they don't have recoding support.

than they should use 'FULL'

i would agree to en utf-8 only

called phpMyAdmin-en-x.y.z?
or phpMyAdmin-x.y.z-en?
or phpMyAdmin-x.y.z-en-only?


>> - utf-8 only [this would be default download option]
> ok

means phpMyAdmin + utf-8 lang files?

called phpMyAdmin-x.y.z?

ok

>
>> - full
> ok

means phpMyAdmin with all lang files?

called phpMyAdmin-full-x.y.z?
or phpMyAdmin-x.y.z-full?

ok


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[Marc Delisle]

Michal Čihař a écrit :
> Hi
>
> On Thu, 05 Oct 2006 07:55:45 -0400
> Marc Delisle <Marc.Delisle@...> wrote:
>
>> I would prefer "english only" with all the English charsets, to be
>> compatible with pre-MySQL 4.1 machines if they don't have recoding support.
>
> Are there enough such machines?

Yes, for example, godaddy.com (as told to me by one of their users).

>
>> Michal, do you mean that PMA would be included in all these, not just
>> the language files?
>
> Yes

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[Michal Čihař]

Hi

On Thu, 05 Oct 2006 15:27:57 +0200
Sebastian Mendel <lists@...> wrote:
 
> >> - full
> > ok
>
> means phpMyAdmin with all lang files?

Yes

About naming I'd prefer something like:

phpMyAdmin-english-x.y.z
phpMyAdmin-default-x.y.z
phpMyAdmin-full-x.y.z

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[Marc Delisle]

Sebastian Mendel a écrit :

> Marc Delisle schrieb:
>
>>> - english-utf-8 only
>> I would prefer "english only" with all the English charsets, to be
>> compatible with pre-MySQL 4.1 machines if they don't have recoding support.
>
> than they should use 'FULL'
>
> i would agree to en utf-8 only
>
> called phpMyAdmin-en-x.y.z?
> or phpMyAdmin-x.y.z-en?
> or phpMyAdmin-x.y.z-en-only?

Here are my suggestions:

phpMyAdmin-x.y.z-en
>
>
>>> - utf-8 only [this would be default download option]
>> ok
>
> means phpMyAdmin + utf-8 lang files?
>
> called phpMyAdmin-x.y.z?

phpMyAdmin-x.y.z-all-utf-8

>
> ok
>
>>> - full
>> ok
>
> means phpMyAdmin with all lang files?
>
> called phpMyAdmin-full-x.y.z?
> or phpMyAdmin-x.y.z-full?

phpMyAdmin-x.y.z-all

This way, there would no longer be phpMyAdmin-x.y.z, so a user is forced
to choose exactly what he wants. Is this good?

I would be tempted to drop the .tar.gz files.

>
> ok
>
>


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