SVG improvement

[Carlos Dominguez]

Hi guys,

Sorry for the absence, I wanted to dedicate a little time to my thesis. I did a commit earlier this day which now handles the picewise path curves from the svg file and now they are just one line each. I spent the whole weekend doing test on the knot vector because it's not just like implementing nurbsconnectcurve because that way it wouldn't preserve the actual topology of the path. Well finally I came up with an idea of how to make it work and implemented it, I've been having a bug with one of my svg test drawings and I'm kinda trying to figure it out now but it works pretty much the same as before just with the single curve instead of a piece-wise curve. I was just writting to let you know where was I and that I'm still alive :-)

Bests,
Carlos

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TEL: [phone]
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[hoako]

Carlos Dominguez wrote:

> Hi guys,
>
> Sorry for the absence, I wanted to dedicate a little time to my thesis.
> I did a commit earlier this day which now handles the picewise path
> curves from the svg file and now they are just one line each. I spent
> the whole weekend doing test on the knot vector because it's not just
> like implementing nurbsconnectcurve because that way it wouldn't
> preserve the actual topology of the path. Well finally I came up with an
> idea of how to make it work and implemented it, I've been having a bug
> with one of my svg test drawings and I'm kinda trying to figure it out
> now but it works pretty much the same as before just with the single
> curve instead of a piece-wise curve. I was just writting to let you know
> where was I and that I'm still alive :-)

Hi again!

I checked you changes, i don't know if you are still stuck on connecting curves.

Seems the rounded rectangles are still missing continuity.
Check the following file and screen.
http://www.k-3d.org/wiki/Image:SVGReader_Continuity_Test.png
http://www.k-3d.org/wiki/Image:SVGReader_continuity_test.k3d
Also with this file you can change the shape to test easily.

We are still missing the SVGWriter plugin.

Cheers!
Joaquín


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[hoako]

Carlos Dominguez wrote:

> Hi guys,
>
> Sorry for the absence, I wanted to dedicate a little time to my thesis.
> I did a commit earlier this day which now handles the picewise path
> curves from the svg file and now they are just one line each. I spent
> the whole weekend doing test on the knot vector because it's not just
> like implementing nurbsconnectcurve because that way it wouldn't
> preserve the actual topology of the path. Well finally I came up with an
> idea of how to make it work and implemented it, I've been having a bug
> with one of my svg test drawings and I'm kinda trying to figure it out
> now but it works pretty much the same as before just with the single
> curve instead of a piece-wise curve. I was just writting to let you know
> where was I and that I'm still alive :-)

Good job! I forgot about telling :-)


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[hoako]

Carlos Dominguez wrote:
> Hi guys,
>
> Sorry for the absence, I wanted to dedicate a little time to my thesis.
> I did a commit earlier this day which now handles the picewise path
> curves from the svg file and now they are just one line each. I spent
Good work! I forgot about telling it :-)
I look forward for more good news

Cheers!
Joaquín


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[Carlos Dominguez]

Yes, I think I know whats going on, it actually is continuous but to preserve the original curvature I had to add some extra repeated points to the curve. I'm gonna try to think of a way of fixing it, suggestions welcome :-)

BTW I just commited a quake md2 file reader, sorry I didn't consult about it before coding but I think it's a valuable addition to the set as many open source games and beginning game developers still use that file format for characters. I'm now working on the importer which should parse correctly the animation.

Bests,
Carlos

On Fri, Jul 25, 2008 at 6:04 AM, Joaquín Duo <hoakoduo@...> wrote:

Carlos Dominguez wrote:
> Hi guys,
>
> Sorry for the absence, I wanted to dedicate a little time to my thesis.
> I did a commit earlier this day which now handles the picewise path
> curves from the svg file and now they are just one line each. I spent
> the whole weekend doing test on the knot vector because it's not just
> like implementing nurbsconnectcurve because that way it wouldn't
> preserve the actual topology of the path. Well finally I came up with an
> idea of how to make it work and implemented it, I've been having a bug
> with one of my svg test drawings and I'm kinda trying to figure it out
> now but it works pretty much the same as before just with the single
> curve instead of a piece-wise curve. I was just writting to let you know
> where was I and that I'm still alive :-)

Hi again!

I checked you changes, i don't know if you are still stuck on connecting curves.

Seems the rounded rectangles are still missing continuity.
Check the following file and screen.
http://www.k-3d.org/wiki/Image:SVGReader_Continuity_Test.png
http://www.k-3d.org/wiki/Image:SVGReader_continuity_test.k3d
Also with this file you can change the shape to test easily.

We are still missing the SVGWriter plugin.

Cheers!
Joaquín


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Carlos Andres Dominguez Caballero
TEL: [phone]
CEL: (52 443) 2028344
fismat.umich.mx/~carlosadc

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[hoako]

Carlos Dominguez wrote:

> Yes, I think I know whats going on, it actually is continuous but to
> preserve the original curvature I had to add some extra repeated points
> to the curve. I'm gonna try to think of a way of fixing it, suggestions
> welcome :-)
>
> BTW I just commited a quake md2 file reader, sorry I didn't consult
> about it before coding but I think it's a valuable addition to the set
> as many open source games and beginning game developers still use that
> file format for characters. I'm now working on the importer which should
> parse correctly the animation.

Ok, but how are you going to handle animation? Actually as far as I know the
K-3D animation support is a bit immature.

I guess those animation should deform the mesh, AKA mesh skin modifier. How do
you plan to support this?

Please upload your information to the wiki.

Cheers!
Joaquín


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[Carlos Dominguez]

Well, md2 doesn't use any interpolation for the animation, it basically stores the vertex coordinates on each frame of the animation. Right now in the mesh reader I added a variable named "frame" which you can use to travel in the model animation and stay with the pose you want. I was thinking on implementing the complete animation in an importer. As you pointed out it will probably be a little wierd but I think I can manage it, I'm gonna document the procedure on wiki. As of know what I can think of for the first approach is to connect the model to the timesource and actually changing the points on each timechange.

Bests,
Carlos

On Sat, Jul 26, 2008 at 1:01 AM, Joaquín Duo <hoakoduo@...> wrote:

Carlos Dominguez wrote:
> Yes, I think I know whats going on, it actually is continuous but to
> preserve the original curvature I had to add some extra repeated points
> to the curve. I'm gonna try to think of a way of fixing it, suggestions
> welcome :-)
>
> BTW I just commited a quake md2 file reader, sorry I didn't consult
> about it before coding but I think it's a valuable addition to the set
> as many open source games and beginning game developers still use that
> file format for characters. I'm now working on the importer which should
> parse correctly the animation.

Ok, but how are you going to handle animation? Actually as far as I know the
K-3D animation support is a bit immature.

I guess those animation should deform the mesh, AKA mesh skin modifier. How do
you plan to support this?

Please upload your information to the wiki.

Cheers!
Joaquín


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--
Carlos Andres Dominguez Caballero
TEL: [phone]
CEL: (52 443) 2028344
fismat.umich.mx/~carlosadc

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[Timothy M. Shead]

Carlos Dominguez wrote:

> On Sat, Jul 26, 2008 at 1:01 AM, Joaquín Duo <hoakoduo@...
> <mailto:hoakoduo@...>> wrote:
> Ok, but how are you going to handle animation? Actually as far as I
> know the
> K-3D animation support is a bit immature.
>
> I guess those animation should deform the mesh, AKA mesh skin
> modifier. How do
> you plan to support this?
> Well, md2 doesn't use any interpolation for the animation, it
> basically stores the vertex coordinates on each frame of the
> animation. Right now in the mesh reader I added a variable named
> "frame" which you can use to travel in the model animation and stay
> with the pose you want. I was thinking on implementing the complete
> animation in an importer. As you pointed out it will probably be a
> little wierd but I think I can manage it, I'm gonna document the
> procedure on wiki. As of know what I can think of for the first
> approach is to connect the model to the timesource and actually
> changing the points on each timechange.

This sounds perfectly reasonable, and may provide useful insight into
animation elsewhere.  Definitely provide an md2 example with animation
in your tests - I'm looking forward to seeing it in action.

Remember that - in addition to being a critical software quality tool -
tests are a great way to demonstrate your work!

Cheers,
Tim

--
Timothy M. Shead, K-3D founder
http://www.k-3d.org



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[hoako]

Carlos Dominguez wrote:
> Well, md2 doesn't use any interpolation for the animation, it basically
> stores the vertex coordinates on each frame of the animation. Right now
> in the mesh reader I added a variable named "frame" which you can use to
> travel in the model animation and stay with the pose you want. I was
> thinking on implementing the complete animation in an importer. As you
This is a good approach for a MeshReader, great solution. :-)

But for a Document Importer I don't think this is the right solution, in fact
some sort of new node should be done. Like Md2MeshSource, but that wouldn't be nice.

Instead i guess you should add animation support to the TweakPoint modifier.
That would be the right thing when Importing. Although I don't know if it is
worth making this change now. In case you make the Importer do it without
animation and then add it.

> pointed out it will probably be a little wierd but I think I can manage
> it, I'm gonna document the procedure on wiki. As of know what I can
> think of for the first approach is to connect the model to the
> timesource and actually changing the points on each timechange.
>
Cheers!
Joaquín.




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[Carlos Dominguez]

Hi,

I was actually looking at the possibility of doing it with a TweakPoint node but isn't it better to use just a simple_deformation_modifier node? and do something similar as what I did in clothing using an m_time variable and connecting it to the default TimeSource.

With this in mind, I have a question regarding the creation of a plug-in. If I create a node in a document (simple_deformation_modifier in this case) how can I access the code of a function (in this case on_deform_mesh) so I can actually tweak the points for the animation? Thanks in advance

Bests,
Carlos

On Sun, Jul 27, 2008 at 7:02 AM, Joaquín Duo <hoakoduo@...> wrote:

Carlos Dominguez wrote:
> Well, md2 doesn't use any interpolation for the animation, it basically
> stores the vertex coordinates on each frame of the animation. Right now
> in the mesh reader I added a variable named "frame" which you can use to
> travel in the model animation and stay with the pose you want. I was
> thinking on implementing the complete animation in an importer. As you

This is a good approach for a MeshReader, great solution. :-)

But for a Document Importer I don't think this is the right solution, in fact
some sort of new node should be done. Like Md2MeshSource, but that wouldn't be nice.

Instead i guess you should add animation support to the TweakPoint modifier.
That would be the right thing when Importing. Although I don't know if it is
worth making this change now. In case you make the Importer do it without
animation and then add it.

> pointed out it will probably be a little wierd but I think I can manage
> it, I'm gonna document the procedure on wiki. As of know what I can
> think of for the first approach is to connect the model to the
> timesource and actually changing the points on each timechange.
>

Cheers!
Joaquín.

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TEL: [phone]
CEL: (52 443) 2028344
fismat.umich.mx/~carlosadc

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[Timothy M. Shead]

Joaquín Duo wrote:

> Carlos Dominguez wrote:
>  
>> Well, md2 doesn't use any interpolation for the animation, it basically
>> stores the vertex coordinates on each frame of the animation. Right now
>> in the mesh reader I added a variable named "frame" which you can use to
>> travel in the model animation and stay with the pose you want. I was
>> thinking on implementing the complete animation in an importer. As you
>>    
> This is a good approach for a MeshReader, great solution. :-)
>
> But for a Document Importer I don't think this is the right solution, in fact
> some sort of new node should be done. Like Md2MeshSource, but that wouldn't be nice.
>  

Is an MD2 importer a goal?  What happened to Collada?

> Instead i guess you should add animation support to the TweakPoint modifier.
> That would be the right thing when Importing. Although I don't know if it is
> worth making this change now. In case you make the Importer do it without
> animation and then add it.
>  
No, TweakPoints is fine the way it is.  The goal of a pipeline-based
system is simple components that solve specific tasks.

Tim

--
Timothy M. Shead, K-3D founder
http://www.k-3d.org



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[Timothy M. Shead]

Carlos Dominguez wrote:
> I was actually looking at the possibility of doing it with a
> TweakPoint node but isn't it better to use just a
> simple_deformation_modifier node? and do something similar as what I
> did in clothing using an m_time variable and connecting it to the
> default TimeSource.
To clarify, TweakPoints is a plugin that applies a single fixed set of
point positions to its input mesh.  k3d::simple_deformation_modifier is
a convenience class that is used to *implement* various plugins.
> With this in mind, I have a question regarding the creation of a
> plug-in. If I create a node in a document (simple_deformation_modifier
> in this case) how can I access the code of a function (in this case
> on_deform_mesh) so I can actually tweak the points for the animation?
> Thanks in advance
You don't call on_deform_mesh from the outside, it is a private
implementation detail of a plugin.  If you find yourself trying to do
this, it's a sign that you haven't decomposed a problem into the correct
pipeline components.  In general, you should be able to do everything
you need simply by reading / writing plugin properties, and making /
breaking connections in the pipeline.

If you *were* to implement an MD2 importer, I envision it performing
exactly two tasks:

1) Creating an instance of MD2MeshReader, initialized to point to the
same MD2 file as the importer.  MD2MeshReader should already extract
every thing of value (other than texture) in an MD2.
2) Creating an instance of BitmapReader for each texture in the MD2
file, initialized to point to the texture specified in the MD2 file.

There literally isn't anything else you could do at this point.  Also,
it's my understanding that 2) may be of little value, since MD2 files
usually reference textures located in a pak file, not on disk ...

Cheers,
Tim

--
Timothy M. Shead, K-3D founder
http://www.k-3d.org



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[hoako]

Timothy M. Shead wrote:

> Joaquín Duo wrote:
>> Carlos Dominguez wrote:
>>  
>>> Well, md2 doesn't use any interpolation for the animation, it basically
>>> stores the vertex coordinates on each frame of the animation. Right now
>>> in the mesh reader I added a variable named "frame" which you can use to
>>> travel in the model animation and stay with the pose you want. I was
>>> thinking on implementing the complete animation in an importer. As you
>>>    
>> This is a good approach for a MeshReader, great solution. :-)
>>
>> But for a Document Importer I don't think this is the right solution, in fact
>> some sort of new node should be done. Like Md2MeshSource, but that wouldn't be nice.
>>  
> Is an MD2 importer a goal?  What happened to Collada?

Well Carlos should decide. Collada importer should be finished, it lacks basic
material support and lighting. Although he was taking a breath with md2.
Besides I don't know if md2 has the merit of an Importer right now.

>> Instead i guess you should add animation support to the TweakPoint modifier.
>> That would be the right thing when Importing. Although I don't know if it is
>> worth making this change now. In case you make the Importer do it without
>> animation and then add it.
>>  
> No, TweakPoints is fine the way it is.  The goal of a pipeline-based
> system is simple components that solve specific tasks.

I agree, but what if the users wants to animate the points interactively? how
the move points tool will distinguish which plugin is necessary? Or should this
be accomplish some other way? I had that doubt.

Nevertheless Carlos can do a different deformation plugin as he suggested in the
mean time.

Joaquín


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[Carlos Dominguez]

Hi,

Well, I completed the md2 meshreader and as you pointed out It has probably no sense in doing the whole importer.  It is true that textures for quake are loaded from .pak files but I intended this plug-in for other developers who would like to use md2 as their 3d models file format outside quake on independent projects which not necesarily would be on a .pak file, anyway it's probably for the best that I don't continue with the md2 importer and just move on.

As we have discussed with Joaquín, we both agree that a 3ds loader is a good idea given the lots of 3d models freely available on the internet in 3ds format. I am currently working on a 3ds too. I commited the template class before but it was actually  empty still. With all this coming I'm a little confused on what I should or shouldn't do. Probably the main reason is because I keep forgetting on updating the wiki where we can see things a-priori but now I'm going to put a big sign on my LCD "update wiki!" hehehe :-)

Maybe I should probably work on what you (Tim) pointed out on the GSoC assingments about the tests and documentation while this things clears out. I also have a question about that :-) I have all my test files which I used to create the svg, collada and md2 plug-ins so where should I put them? on the wiki or  on the tests folder or another custom folder inside each plug-in folder? Thank you and sorry about all the questions :-P I just got really confused

Bests,
Carlos

On Mon, Jul 28, 2008 at 11:22 PM, Joaquín Duo <hoakoduo@...> wrote:

Timothy M. Shead wrote:
> Joaquín Duo wrote:
>> Carlos Dominguez wrote:
>>
>>> Well, md2 doesn't use any interpolation for the animation, it basically
>>> stores the vertex coordinates on each frame of the animation. Right now
>>> in the mesh reader I added a variable named "frame" which you can use to
>>> travel in the model animation and stay with the pose you want. I was
>>> thinking on implementing the complete animation in an importer. As you
>>>
>> This is a good approach for a MeshReader, great solution. :-)
>>
>> But for a Document Importer I don't think this is the right solution, in fact
>> some sort of new node should be done. Like Md2MeshSource, but that wouldn't be nice.
>>
> Is an MD2 importer a goal?  What happened to Collada?

Well Carlos should decide. Collada importer should be finished, it lacks basic
material support and lighting. Although he was taking a breath with md2.
Besides I don't know if md2 has the merit of an Importer right now.

>> Instead i guess you should add animation support to the TweakPoint modifier.
>> That would be the right thing when Importing. Although I don't know if it is
>> worth making this change now. In case you make the Importer do it without
>> animation and then add it.
>>
> No, TweakPoints is fine the way it is.  The goal of a pipeline-based
> system is simple components that solve specific tasks.

I agree, but what if the users wants to animate the points interactively? how
the move points tool will distinguish which plugin is necessary? Or should this
be accomplish some other way? I had that doubt.

Nevertheless Carlos can do a different deformation plugin as he suggested in the
mean time.

Joaquín

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TEL: [phone]
CEL: (52 443) 2028344
fismat.umich.mx/~carlosadc

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[hoako]

Carlos Dominguez wrote:

> Hi,
>
> Well, I completed the md2 meshreader and as you pointed out It has
> probably no sense in doing the whole importer.  It is true that textures
> for quake are loaded from .pak files but I intended this plug-in for
> other developers who would like to use md2 as their 3d models file
> format outside quake on independent projects which not necesarily would
> be on a .pak file, anyway it's probably for the best that I don't
> continue with the md2 importer and just move on.
>
> As we have discussed with Joaquín, we both agree that a 3ds loader is a
> good idea given the lots of 3d models freely available on the internet
> in 3ds format. I am currently working on a 3ds too. I commited the
> template class before but it was actually  empty still. With all this
> coming I'm a little confused on what I should or shouldn't do. Probably
> the main reason is because I keep forgetting on updating the wiki where
> we can see things a-priori but now I'm going to put a big sign on my LCD
> "update wiki!" hehehe :-)
>
> Maybe I should probably work on what you (Tim) pointed out on the GSoC
> assingments about the tests and documentation while this things clears
> out. I also have a question about that :-) I have all my test files
> which I used to create the svg, collada and md2 plug-ins so where should
> I put them? on the wiki or  on the tests folder or another custom folder

Oh, this is quite simple.

Check the following on the source root:
tests/
tests/meshes

Also see this article which is very complete.
http://www.k-3d.org/wiki/Writing_Regression_Tests

Cheers!
Joaquín


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