tag:www.nabble.com,2006:forum-13612Nabble - Perl - Cgi-Application2008-10-06T22:22:34ZFor discussion of the use and development of the CGI::Application module, and related systems. CGI::Application is a framework for building web-based applications in Perl.tag:www.nabble.com,2006:post-19851254Re: Re: Patches available for ::Plugin::Routes (was: Re: New plugin idea based/inspired on CA Dispatch)2008-10-06T22:22:34Z2008-10-06T22:22:34ZPorta-2Mark:
<br>(Sorry for the delay)
<br>It took some time to do it, but it's done.
<br>Check it out.
<br>Now the routes() sub registers all the runmodes declared, in the setup
<br>stage. So, there's no need to register the runmodes in prerun.
<br><br><a href="http://github.com/Porta/cgi--application--plugin--routes/tree/master/lib/CGI/Application/Plugin/Routes.pm#LC34" target="_top" rel="nofollow">http://github.com/Porta/cgi--application--plugin--routes/tree/master/lib/CGI/Application/Plugin/Routes.pm#LC34</a><br><br>I think it's ready to go.
<br><br>Thoughts?
<br><br>On Sat, Sep 27, 2008 at 1:25 PM, Mark Stosberg <<a href="http://www.nabble.com/user/SendEmail.jtp?type=post&post=19851254&i=0" target="_top" rel="nofollow">mark@...</a>> wrote:
<div class='shrinkable-quote'><br>>
<br>>> Sorry, but I didn't understood this last sentence:
<br>>> > The fix is to immediately the routes table when we call "routes" in
<br>>> > setup, and register the run modes there, not each time we are in the
<br>>> > pre-run callback.
<br>>
<br>> I'm sorry, my grammar was poor. I meant "immediately *process* the
<br>> routes table when we call routes() in setup(). We'll register the run
<br>> modes all at once there, instead of dynamically in the prerun()
<br>> callback.
<br>>
<br>> Thanks for your continued work on this Julian!
<br>>
<br>> Mark
<br>>
<br>> --
<br>> <a href="http://mark.stosberg.com/blog" target="_top" rel="nofollow">http://mark.stosberg.com/blog</a><br>>
<br>>
<br>>
<br>>
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<br><br><p>From forum: <a href="http://www.nabble.com/cgiapp%40lists.erlbaum.net-f13613.html" embed="fixTarget[13613]" target="_top" >cgiapp@lists.erlbaum.net</a></p>tag:www.nabble.com,2006:post-19826177Re: Combining DBIx::Simple and CGI::Session2008-10-05T09:14:23Z2008-10-05T09:14:23ZMark Stosberg<div class='shrinkable-quote'>> >>>> Use 2 handles, 1 via DBIx::Simple for all normal queries, and 1
<br>> >>>> via DBI
<br>> >>>> just for use with CGI::Session?
<br>> >>>
<br>> >>> Actually, another possibility is to use 2 DBIx::Simple-based
<br>> >>> handles,
<br>> >>> one for all normal queries, and one to pass to CGI::Session but
<br>> >>> not ever
<br>> >>> use via DBIx::Simple.
<br>> >>
<br>> >> I asked the author about this. I think it's not that the dual-life
<br>> >> My recommendation is to share the handle between DBIx::Simple and
<br>> >> CGI::Simple and test that your application doesn't blow up.
<br>> >
<br>> > OK. Thanx for checking.
<br>>
<br>> Is there a risk that a transaction will span the app and the session
<br>> with a single connection? You may wish to rollback one and commit the
<br>> other...
</div><br>I can't see how this would come up without some intentionally bad
<br>design.
<br><br> Mark
<br><br>--
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<br><br><p>From forum: <a href="http://www.nabble.com/cgiapp%40lists.erlbaum.net-f13613.html" embed="fixTarget[13613]" target="_top" >cgiapp@lists.erlbaum.net</a></p>tag:www.nabble.com,2006:post-19826098Re: New Plugin: RunmodeDeclare2008-10-05T09:07:43Z2008-10-05T09:07:43ZMark Stosberg> I haven't had time to go and try it out [yet], but I'm curious.
<br>>
<br>> If I have something like this:
<br>>
<br>> startmode begin { "Here" }
<br>>
<br>> and I'm running my app under perl -d, can I set a breakpoint in the
<br>> sub named begin, or is there magic happening that means that there's
<br>> no actual sub named begin?
<br><br>From related docs:
<br><br> "This totally breaks the debugger. Will have to wait on Devel::Declare fixes."
<br><br><a href="http://search.cpan.org/~mschwern/Method-Signatures-0.11/lib/Method/Signatures.pm#Debugging" target="_top" rel="nofollow">http://search.cpan.org/~mschwern/Method-Signatures-0.11/lib/Method/Signatures.pm#Debugging</a><br><br> Mark
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<br><br><p>From forum: <a href="http://www.nabble.com/cgiapp%40lists.erlbaum.net-f13613.html" embed="fixTarget[13613]" target="_top" >cgiapp@lists.erlbaum.net</a></p>tag:www.nabble.com,2006:post-19792938Re: Re: Combining DBIx::Simple and CGI::Session2008-10-02T23:48:02Z2008-10-02T23:48:02ZDan Horne<br>On 2/10/2008, at 03:45 PM, Ron Savage wrote:
<br><div class='shrinkable-quote'><br>> Hi Mark
<br>>
<br>> On Wed, 2008-10-01 at 22:05 -0400, Mark Stosberg wrote:
<br>>>>> The docs for DBIx::Simple cleary warn about using the dbh()
<br>>>>> method to
<br>>>>> get the db handle for use outside DBIx::Simple.
<br>>>>>
<br>>>>> And yet, with CGI::Session, if I pass in a handle (returned from
<br>>>>> DBIx::Simple or otherwise), I know CGI::Session will be doing
<br>>>>> queries
<br>>>>> whenever it feels like it.
<br>>>>>
<br>>>>> So, what to people do?
<br>>>>>
<br>>>>> Use 2 handles, 1 via DBIx::Simple for all normal queries, and 1
<br>>>>> via DBI
<br>>>>> just for use with CGI::Session?
<br>>>>
<br>>>> Actually, another possibility is to use 2 DBIx::Simple-based
<br>>>> handles,
<br>>>> one for all normal queries, and one to pass to CGI::Session but
<br>>>> not ever
<br>>>> use via DBIx::Simple.
<br>>>
<br>>> I asked the author about this. I think it's not that the dual-life
<br>>> handle causes problems inherinently, it's more of a "know what you
<br>>> are
<br>>> doing" situation. If I recall the specific issue, DBIx::Simple does
<br>>> it's
<br>>> own garbage collection, and you are encouraged to not mess that up,
<br>>> which shouldn't be too hard.
<br>>>
<br>>>> Recommendations?
<br>>>
<br>>> My recommendation is to share the handle between DBIx::Simple and
<br>>> CGI::Simple and test that your application doesn't blow up.
<br>>
<br>> OK. Thanx for checking.
<br>>
</div><br>Is there a risk that a transaction will span the app and the session
<br>with a single connection? You may wish to rollback one and commit the
<br>other...
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<br><br><p>From forum: <a href="http://www.nabble.com/cgiapp%40lists.erlbaum.net-f13613.html" embed="fixTarget[13613]" target="_top" >cgiapp@lists.erlbaum.net</a></p>tag:www.nabble.com,2006:post-19791551Re: New Plugin: RunmodeDeclare2008-10-02T20:30:38Z2008-10-02T20:30:38ZGeorge Hartzell-2Mark Stosberg writes:
<br> >
<br> > As Rhesa proposed, he has followed through and released a plugin to add the
<br> > Devel::Declare / Method::Signatures magic to CGI::Application:
<br> >
<br> > <a href="http://search.cpan.org/perldoc?CGI::Application::Plugin::RunmodeDeclare" target="_top" rel="nofollow">http://search.cpan.org/perldoc?CGI::Application::Plugin::RunmodeDeclare</a><br> >
<br> > Used in combination with Method::Signatures, this approach can noticably shorten
<br> > the amount of code you need to write, shrinking your 'setup()' routine and reducing
<br> > "busy work" of writing "my $self = shift;" and unpacking other parameters.
<br> >
<br> > For a comparison, I refactored the simple "widget" example from the
<br> > CGI::Application documentation. The result was about 15% fewer lines of code.
<br> >
<br> > Take a look for yourself at the RunmodeDeclare plugin
<br> > [...]
<br><br>I haven't had time to go and try it out [yet], but I'm curious.
<br><br>If I have something like this:
<br><br> startmode begin { "Here" }
<br><br>and I'm running my app under perl -d, can I set a breakpoint in the
<br>sub named begin, or is there magic happening that means that there's
<br>no actual sub named begin?
<br><br>g.
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<br><br><p>From forum: <a href="http://www.nabble.com/cgiapp%40lists.erlbaum.net-f13613.html" embed="fixTarget[13613]" target="_top" >cgiapp@lists.erlbaum.net</a></p>tag:www.nabble.com,2006:post-19772571Re: Re: Combining DBIx::Simple and CGI::Session2008-10-01T19:45:58Z2008-10-01T19:45:58ZRon SavageHi Mark
<br><br>On Wed, 2008-10-01 at 22:05 -0400, Mark Stosberg wrote:
<div class='shrinkable-quote'><br>> > > The docs for DBIx::Simple cleary warn about using the dbh() method to
<br>> > > get the db handle for use outside DBIx::Simple.
<br>> > >
<br>> > > And yet, with CGI::Session, if I pass in a handle (returned from
<br>> > > DBIx::Simple or otherwise), I know CGI::Session will be doing queries
<br>> > > whenever it feels like it.
<br>> > >
<br>> > > So, what to people do?
<br>> > >
<br>> > > Use 2 handles, 1 via DBIx::Simple for all normal queries, and 1 via DBI
<br>> > > just for use with CGI::Session?
<br>> >
<br>> > Actually, another possibility is to use 2 DBIx::Simple-based handles,
<br>> > one for all normal queries, and one to pass to CGI::Session but not ever
<br>> > use via DBIx::Simple.
<br>>
<br>> I asked the author about this. I think it's not that the dual-life
<br>> handle causes problems inherinently, it's more of a "know what you are
<br>> doing" situation. If I recall the specific issue, DBIx::Simple does it's
<br>> own garbage collection, and you are encouraged to not mess that up,
<br>> which shouldn't be too hard.
<br>>
<br>> > Recommendations?
<br>>
<br>> My recommendation is to share the handle between DBIx::Simple and
<br>> CGI::Simple and test that your application doesn't blow up.
</div><br>OK. Thanx for checking.
<br><br>--
<br>Ron Savage
<br><a href="http://www.nabble.com/user/SendEmail.jtp?type=post&post=19772571&i=0" target="_top" rel="nofollow">ron@...</a>
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<br><br><p>From forum: <a href="http://www.nabble.com/cgiapp%40lists.erlbaum.net-f13613.html" embed="fixTarget[13613]" target="_top" >cgiapp@lists.erlbaum.net</a></p>tag:www.nabble.com,2006:post-19772317Re: Combining DBIx::Simple and CGI::Session2008-10-01T19:05:40Z2008-10-01T19:05:40ZMark Stosberg<div class='shrinkable-quote'>> > The docs for DBIx::Simple cleary warn about using the dbh() method to
<br>> > get the db handle for use outside DBIx::Simple.
<br>> >
<br>> > And yet, with CGI::Session, if I pass in a handle (returned from
<br>> > DBIx::Simple or otherwise), I know CGI::Session will be doing queries
<br>> > whenever it feels like it.
<br>> >
<br>> > So, what to people do?
<br>> >
<br>> > Use 2 handles, 1 via DBIx::Simple for all normal queries, and 1 via DBI
<br>> > just for use with CGI::Session?
<br>>
<br>> Actually, another possibility is to use 2 DBIx::Simple-based handles,
<br>> one for all normal queries, and one to pass to CGI::Session but not ever
<br>> use via DBIx::Simple.
</div><br>I asked the author about this. I think it's not that the dual-life
<br>handle causes problems inherinently, it's more of a "know what you are
<br>doing" situation. If I recall the specific issue, DBIx::Simple does it's
<br>own garbage collection, and you are encouraged to not mess that up,
<br>which shouldn't be too hard.
<br><br>> Recommendations?
<br><br>My recommendation is to share the handle between DBIx::Simple and
<br>CGI::Simple and test that your application doesn't blow up.
<br><br> Mark
<br><br>--
<br><a href="http://mark.stosberg.com/" target="_top" rel="nofollow">http://mark.stosberg.com/</a><br><br><br><br><br>##### CGI::Application community mailing list ################
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<br><br><p>From forum: <a href="http://www.nabble.com/cgiapp%40lists.erlbaum.net-f13613.html" embed="fixTarget[13613]" target="_top" >cgiapp@lists.erlbaum.net</a></p>tag:www.nabble.com,2006:post-19753651Re: Combining DBIx::Simple and CGI::Session2008-09-30T19:36:19Z2008-09-30T19:36:19ZRon SavageHi Ron
<br><br>On Wed, 2008-10-01 at 12:33 +1000, Ron Savage wrote:
<div class='shrinkable-quote'><br>> Hi Folks
<br>>
<br>> The docs for DBIx::Simple cleary warn about using the dbh() method to
<br>> get the db handle for use outside DBIx::Simple.
<br>>
<br>> And yet, with CGI::Session, if I pass in a handle (returned from
<br>> DBIx::Simple or otherwise), I know CGI::Session will be doing queries
<br>> whenever it feels like it.
<br>>
<br>> So, what to people do?
<br>>
<br>> Use 2 handles, 1 via DBIx::Simple for all normal queries, and 1 via DBI
<br>> just for use with CGI::Session?
</div><br>Actually, another possibility is to use 2 DBIx::Simple-based handles,
<br>one for all normal queries, and one to pass to CGI::Session but not ever
<br>use via DBIx::Simple.
<br><br>Recommendations?
<br><br>--
<br>Ron Savage
<br><a href="http://www.nabble.com/user/SendEmail.jtp?type=post&post=19753651&i=0" target="_top" rel="nofollow">ron@...</a>
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<br><br><p>From forum: <a href="http://www.nabble.com/cgiapp%40lists.erlbaum.net-f13613.html" embed="fixTarget[13613]" target="_top" >cgiapp@lists.erlbaum.net</a></p>tag:www.nabble.com,2006:post-19753631Combining DBIx::Simple and CGI::Session2008-09-30T19:33:46Z2008-09-30T19:33:46ZRon SavageHi Folks
<br><br>The docs for DBIx::Simple cleary warn about using the dbh() method to
<br>get the db handle for use outside DBIx::Simple.
<br><br>And yet, with CGI::Session, if I pass in a handle (returned from
<br>DBIx::Simple or otherwise), I know CGI::Session will be doing queries
<br>whenever it feels like it.
<br><br>So, what to people do?
<br><br>Use 2 handles, 1 via DBIx::Simple for all normal queries, and 1 via DBI
<br>just for use with CGI::Session?
<br><br>--
<br>Ron Savage
<br><a href="http://www.nabble.com/user/SendEmail.jtp?type=post&post=19753631&i=0" target="_top" rel="nofollow">ron@...</a>
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<br><br><p>From forum: <a href="http://www.nabble.com/cgiapp%40lists.erlbaum.net-f13613.html" embed="fixTarget[13613]" target="_top" >cgiapp@lists.erlbaum.net</a></p>tag:www.nabble.com,2006:post-19752552End of Days2008-09-30T17:04:21Z2008-09-30T17:04:21ZPhillip Hayes<br>I will be out of the office starting 30/09/2008 and will not return until
<br>30/09/2009.
<br><br>Folks,
<br><br>Thanks for the email, however, my tenure here has come to a timely end. You
<br>can contact me at: <a href="http://www.nabble.com/user/SendEmail.jtp?type=post&post=19752552&i=0" target="_top" rel="nofollow">phil.a.hayes@...</a>
<br><br>Best wishes for the future,
<br><br>Phl.
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<br><br><p>From forum: <a href="http://www.nabble.com/cgiapp%40lists.erlbaum.net-f13613.html" embed="fixTarget[13613]" target="_top" >cgiapp@lists.erlbaum.net</a></p>tag:www.nabble.com,2006:post-19749221CAD table placed in external config file2008-09-30T12:54:29Z2008-09-30T12:54:29ZPorta-2... So you don't really need to touch your Dispatch module and you can
<br>just deal with a simple config file
<br><br>Anyone tried it? Any success story?
<br><br>Thanks.
<br><br>Porta.
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<br><br><p>From forum: <a href="http://www.nabble.com/cgiapp%40lists.erlbaum.net-f13613.html" embed="fixTarget[13613]" target="_top" >cgiapp@lists.erlbaum.net</a></p>tag:www.nabble.com,2006:post-19727061Re: ($self vs $c) was: Re: New Plugin: RunmodeDeclare2008-09-29T09:22:10Z2008-09-29T09:22:10ZJoshua Miller-3One more vote for $self.
<br><br>My reasoning - I've inherited a few projects that use something other than
<br>$self, and each had decided it was smarter than sticking to the standard
<br>$self. Try to integrate those, and not constantly forget on which module
<br>you're currently working! And now, a bunch of that project is new,
<br>converted, or imported code using "$self", an awful lot is still using
<br>"$this" (they were php immigrants), and there's a few random places that try
<br>to type less and use something like "$c" or "$s".
<br><br>If one wants to adopt a standard of using "$c" in place of "$self" across
<br>their own project, I have no problem with that - it's one of the great
<br>things about perl, more than one way to do it and all that. But for stuff
<br>meant for the general population of CPAN, 3 extra characters won't kill
<br>anyone. At the very least, for the docs.
<br><br>As for $t, maybe it's just me, but that's my first choice for any
<br>short-lived temp variables, so I've stuck to $tmpl for the template object.
<br>Reads better to me, and hopefully to the next maintainer. YMMV
<br><br>--
<br>Josh I.
<br><br>On Mon, Sep 29, 2008 at 11:39 AM, Richard Jones <<a href="http://www.nabble.com/user/SendEmail.jtp?type=post&post=19727061&i=0" target="_top" rel="nofollow">ra.jones@...</a>>wrote:
<br><div class='shrinkable-quote'><br>> Michael Peters wrote:
<br>>
<br>>> Richard Jones wrote:
<br>>>
<br>>> Actually prefer $c these days as a) it's shorter and therefore quicker
<br>>>> and less easy to mis-spell (I seem to type slef more often than self), but
<br>>>> more importantly, having done a lot of work with Catalyst recently, that's
<br>>>> the Cat standard also, so it's familiar to me.
<br>>>>
<br>>>
<br>>> This actually came up in our discussions and we thought it would cause
<br>>> more confusion since in Catalyst the $c is not $self. It's a different
<br>>> object entirely. So calling it $c in C::A land might confuse the catalyst
<br>>> folks since it's really $self just shorter. Also, for folks playing with
<br>>> Titanium (which btw, does not have a friendly abbreviation :) do you plan on
<br>>> still using $c? Or will you go with $t?
<br>>>
<br>>>
<br>> Yes it's true it could be confusing as we won't need to *manually* shift
<br>> the class object into a variable any more, so the self-documenting nature of
<br>> this step is effectively lost to the unfamiliar observer.
<br>>
<br>> For me though, I still think I prefer the shorter form as it's used in all
<br>> rms and sometimes multiple times within an rm. And providing it doesn't
<br>> clash with any other abbreviated variable name and its use is consistent
<br>> throughout I think it should be OK. Personally I'd be happy to use $t for
<br>> the Titanium object since the letter 't' is even closer to the '$' key than
<br>> is the letter 'c' ;)
<br>> --
<br>> Richard Jones
<br>>
<br>>
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<br><br><p>From forum: <a href="http://www.nabble.com/cgiapp%40lists.erlbaum.net-f13613.html" embed="fixTarget[13613]" target="_top" >cgiapp@lists.erlbaum.net</a></p>tag:www.nabble.com,2006:post-19726279Re: ($self vs $c) was: Re: New Plugin: RunmodeDeclare2008-09-29T08:39:16Z2008-09-29T08:39:16ZRichard Jones-18Michael Peters wrote:
<div class='shrinkable-quote'><br>> Richard Jones wrote:
<br>>
<br>>> Actually prefer $c these days as a) it's shorter and therefore quicker
<br>>> and less easy to mis-spell (I seem to type slef more often than self),
<br>>> but more importantly, having done a lot of work with Catalyst
<br>>> recently, that's the Cat standard also, so it's familiar to me.
<br>>
<br>> This actually came up in our discussions and we thought it would cause
<br>> more confusion since in Catalyst the $c is not $self. It's a different
<br>> object entirely. So calling it $c in C::A land might confuse the
<br>> catalyst folks since it's really $self just shorter. Also, for folks
<br>> playing with Titanium (which btw, does not have a friendly abbreviation
<br>> :) do you plan on still using $c? Or will you go with $t?
<br>>
</div><br>Yes it's true it could be confusing as we won't need to *manually* shift
<br>the class object into a variable any more, so the self-documenting
<br>nature of this step is effectively lost to the unfamiliar observer.
<br><br>For me though, I still think I prefer the shorter form as it's used in
<br>all rms and sometimes multiple times within an rm. And providing it
<br>doesn't clash with any other abbreviated variable name and its use is
<br>consistent throughout I think it should be OK. Personally I'd be happy
<br>to use $t for the Titanium object since the letter 't' is even closer to
<br>the '$' key than is the letter 'c' ;)
<br>--
<br>Richard Jones
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<br><br><p>From forum: <a href="http://www.nabble.com/cgiapp%40lists.erlbaum.net-f13613.html" embed="fixTarget[13613]" target="_top" >cgiapp@lists.erlbaum.net</a></p>tag:www.nabble.com,2006:post-19726204Re: ($self vs $c) was: Re: New Plugin: RunmodeDeclare2008-09-29T08:33:23Z2008-09-29T08:33:23ZMark StosbergOn Mon, 29 Sep 2008 09:14:43 -0400
<br>Michael Peters <<a href="http://www.nabble.com/user/SendEmail.jtp?type=post&post=19726204&i=0" target="_top" rel="nofollow">mpeters@...</a>> wrote:
<br><br>> Richard Jones wrote:
<br>>
<br>> > Actually prefer $c these days as a) it's shorter and therefore quicker
<br>> > and less easy to mis-spell (I seem to type slef more often than self),
<br>> > but more importantly, having done a lot of work with Catalyst recently,
<br>> > that's the Cat standard also, so it's familiar to me.
<br><br>Thanks for the feedback, everyone. The majority of opinions have been
<br>for "$self", so I feel good about proceeding with the dev release for
<br>CGI::App which returns to that.
<br><br>> This actually came up in our discussions and we thought it would cause more
<br>> confusion since in Catalyst the $c is not $self. It's a different object
<br>> entirely. So calling it $c in C::A land might confuse the catalyst folks
<br>> since it's really $self just shorter. Also, for folks playing with Titanium
<br>> (which btw, does not have a friendly abbreviation :) do you plan on still
<br>> using $c? Or will you go with $t?
<br><br>Like Richard, I also found using "$c" being able to switch back and
<br>forth between looking at Catalyst code and CGI::App code. They use "$c"
<br>a lot like we use "$self".
<br><br>I haven't decided whether or not to keep recommending "$c" in Titanium.
<br>It's definitely a project that is more about reflecting personal taste,
<br>while CGI::App is more owned and shared by the community. My personal
<br>taste still leans towards "$c" for my own work.
<br><br>I would not use "$t", which has traditionally being used to represent
<br>the template object returned from load_tmpl(). ( I think even CGI::App
<br>documents it that way. )
<br><br>Does anyone remember the source formatting in CGI::Application::Plus?
<br><a href="http://search.cpan.org/src/DOMIZIO/CGI-Application-Plus-1.21/lib/CGI/Application/Plus.pm" target="_top" rel="nofollow">http://search.cpan.org/src/DOMIZIO/CGI-Application-Plus-1.21/lib/CGI/Application/Plus.pm</a><br><br>( For those new here, this is a fork that is *not* generally considered
<br>a "plus" ).
<br><br>It left-aligns commas and semi-colons. I actually agree with the
<br>sentiment that this style makes it easier to catch bugs with missing
<br>semi-colons.
<br><br>I sometimes use the technique in lists of SQL fields, where it is a bug
<br>to include an extra comma.
<br><br>But I don't dare use the technique in Perl code, because it strays so
<br>far from the normal expected standards for code formatting.
<br><br>While you may disagree about the code formatting example, it's an
<br>illustration for the broader point. Sometimes while it makes sense to
<br>follow a standard for the sake of having a standard (Hello, XML), there
<br>are times when the most widely accepted standards turn out not to be
<br>best choices if given the chance to start over.
<br><br> Mark
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<br><br><p>From forum: <a href="http://www.nabble.com/cgiapp%40lists.erlbaum.net-f13613.html" embed="fixTarget[13613]" target="_top" >cgiapp@lists.erlbaum.net</a></p>tag:www.nabble.com,2006:post-19723919Re: Re: New Plugin: RunmodeDeclare2008-09-29T06:23:47Z2008-09-29T06:23:47ZMichael PetersRhesa Rozendaal wrote:
<br><br>> As for the order in which arguments are fetched, I don't mind swapping
<br>> $self->param and $q->param in the fallback order. I don't have a
<br>> practical use case either way. I only use $self->param in this context
<br>> when CA::Dispatch puts url components there. I thought you might
<br>> sometimes want to override a url component with a form field, but I
<br>> haven't seen that happen yet.
<br><br>This is actually a security problem with fetching in the order it does now. It's similar to the PHP
<br>bug where some config setting was turned on by default such that any query params automatically
<br>became real variables in your program. This was fine unless you used one of those variables for
<br>something else. This meant that anyone could craft a URL which would override a variable in your
<br>program. Nasty things can happen.
<br><br>--
<br>Michael Peters
<br>Plus Three, LP
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<br><br><p>From forum: <a href="http://www.nabble.com/cgiapp%40lists.erlbaum.net-f13613.html" embed="fixTarget[13613]" target="_top" >cgiapp@lists.erlbaum.net</a></p>tag:www.nabble.com,2006:post-19723706Re: ($self vs $c) was: Re: New Plugin: RunmodeDeclare2008-09-29T06:14:43Z2008-09-29T06:14:43ZMichael PetersRichard Jones wrote:
<br><br>> Actually prefer $c these days as a) it's shorter and therefore quicker
<br>> and less easy to mis-spell (I seem to type slef more often than self),
<br>> but more importantly, having done a lot of work with Catalyst recently,
<br>> that's the Cat standard also, so it's familiar to me.
<br><br>This actually came up in our discussions and we thought it would cause more confusion since in
<br>Catalyst the $c is not $self. It's a different object entirely. So calling it $c in C::A land might
<br>confuse the catalyst folks since it's really $self just shorter. Also, for folks playing with
<br>Titanium (which btw, does not have a friendly abbreviation :) do you plan on still using $c? Or will
<br>you go with $t?
<br><br>--
<br>Michael Peters
<br>Plus Three, LP
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<br><br><p>From forum: <a href="http://www.nabble.com/cgiapp%40lists.erlbaum.net-f13613.html" embed="fixTarget[13613]" target="_top" >cgiapp@lists.erlbaum.net</a></p>tag:www.nabble.com,2006:post-19720372Re: ($self vs $c) was: Re: New Plugin: RunmodeDeclare2008-09-29T01:57:16Z2008-09-29T01:57:16ZRichard Jones-18Mark Stosberg wrote:
<br><br>> Although I still prefer "$c" in my own code, I thought they made good
<br>> points, so I switched back from "$c" to "$self" in the docs and code of
<br>> the latest CGI::App dev release.
<br>>
<br>> But I'm interested in more opinions on the issue. Richard, do you
<br>> particularlly prefer "$c", or were you mostly following along the docs
<br>> that were updated to switch from "$self" to "$c" ?
<br><br>Actually prefer $c these days as a) it's shorter and therefore quicker
<br>and less easy to mis-spell (I seem to type slef more often than self),
<br>but more importantly, having done a lot of work with Catalyst recently,
<br>that's the Cat standard also, so it's familiar to me.
<br>--
<br>Richard Jones
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<br><br><p>From forum: <a href="http://www.nabble.com/cgiapp%40lists.erlbaum.net-f13613.html" embed="fixTarget[13613]" target="_top" >cgiapp@lists.erlbaum.net</a></p>tag:www.nabble.com,2006:post-19717724Re: ($self vs $c) was: Re: New Plugin: RunmodeDeclare2008-09-28T19:48:29Z2008-09-28T19:48:29ZRon SavageHi Folks
<br><br>> I'll toss in one vote for $self being much less Surprising, both to me
<br>> and to folks with whom I'm sharing code.
<br><br>Yep. $self for me.
<br><br>--
<br>Ron Savage
<br><a href="http://www.nabble.com/user/SendEmail.jtp?type=post&post=19717724&i=0" target="_top" rel="nofollow">ron@...</a>
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<br><br><p>From forum: <a href="http://www.nabble.com/cgiapp%40lists.erlbaum.net-f13613.html" embed="fixTarget[13613]" target="_top" >cgiapp@lists.erlbaum.net</a></p>tag:www.nabble.com,2006:post-19717299Re: ($self vs $c) was: Re: New Plugin: RunmodeDeclare2008-09-28T18:24:06Z2008-09-28T18:24:06ZGeorge Hartzell-2Mark Stosberg writes:
<br> > On Mon, 29 Sep 2008 00:18:02 +0100
<br> > Richard Jones <<a href="http://www.nabble.com/user/SendEmail.jtp?type=post&post=19717299&i=0" target="_top" rel="nofollow">ra.jones@...</a>> wrote:
<br> >
<br> > > Mark Stosberg wrote:
<br> > > > As Rhesa proposed, he has followed through and released a plugin to add the
<br> > > > Devel::Declare / Method::Signatures magic to CGI::Application:
<br> > > >
<br> > > > <a href="http://search.cpan.org/perldoc?CGI::Application::Plugin::RunmodeDeclare" target="_top" rel="nofollow">http://search.cpan.org/perldoc?CGI::Application::Plugin::RunmodeDeclare</a><br> > >
<br> > > Looks like an interesting alternative to CAP::AutoRunmode. One minor
<br> > > irritant is having to put 'runmode foo ($c:)' everywhere (only if using
<br> > > $c instead of $self of course). Might be useful to be able to declare
<br> > > use CGI::Application::Plugin::RunmodeDeclare(invocant => '$c'), or just
<br> > > use CAP::RunmodeDeclare qw($c).
<br> >
<br> > I agree with this sentiment.
<br> >
<br> > This brings back to life the discussion we were having on IRC the other
<br> > day about "$self" vs "$c".
<br> >
<br> > I like "$c" because it's shorter and since it's used all over the code
<br> > base, it's clear enough what it is. And, the first element to 'shift'
<br> > off of @_ in a method must be the invocant.
<br> >
<br> > Michael Peters and Richardo argued in favor of "$self" citing the
<br> > "Principle of Least Surprise" and the expectation that this non-standard
<br> > change would generate more harm in confusion than benefits in
<br> > keystrokes.
<br> >
<br> > Although I still prefer "$c" in my own code, I thought they made good
<br> > points, so I switched back from "$c" to "$self" in the docs and code of
<br> > the latest CGI::App dev release.
<br> >
<br> > But I'm interested in more opinions on the issue. Richard, do you
<br> > particularlly prefer "$c", or were you mostly following along the docs
<br> > that were updated to switch from "$self" to "$c" ?
<br><br>I'll toss in one vote for $self being much less Surprising, both to me
<br>and to folks with whom I'm sharing code.
<br><br>g.
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<br><br><p>From forum: <a href="http://www.nabble.com/cgiapp%40lists.erlbaum.net-f13613.html" embed="fixTarget[13613]" target="_top" >cgiapp@lists.erlbaum.net</a></p>tag:www.nabble.com,2006:post-19717116Re: New Plugin: RunmodeDeclare2008-09-28T17:53:53Z2008-09-28T17:53:53ZRhesa Rozendaal-2Mark Stosberg wrote:
<div class='shrinkable-quote'><br>> On Mon, 29 Sep 2008 00:18:02 +0100
<br>> Richard Jones <<a href="http://www.nabble.com/user/SendEmail.jtp?type=post&post=19717116&i=0" target="_top" rel="nofollow">ra.jones@...</a>> wrote:
<br>>
<br>>> Mark Stosberg wrote:
<br>>>> As Rhesa proposed, he has followed through and released a plugin to add the
<br>>>> Devel::Declare / Method::Signatures magic to CGI::Application:
<br>>>>
<br>>>> <a href="http://search.cpan.org/perldoc?CGI::Application::Plugin::RunmodeDeclare" target="_top" rel="nofollow">http://search.cpan.org/perldoc?CGI::Application::Plugin::RunmodeDeclare</a><br>>> Looks like an interesting alternative to CAP::AutoRunmode. One minor
<br>>> irritant is having to put 'runmode foo ($c:)' everywhere (only if using
<br>>> $c instead of $self of course). Might be useful to be able to declare
<br>>> use CGI::Application::Plugin::RunmodeDeclare(invocant => '$c'), or just
<br>>> use CAP::RunmodeDeclare qw($c).
<br>>
<br>> I agree with this sentiment.
<br>>
<br>> This brings back to life the discussion we were having on IRC the other
<br>> day about "$self" vs "$c".
</div><br><br>While I agree with the others about preferring $self, it doesn't hurt to have
<br>the option. The next release will allow you to say:
<br><br> use CGI::Application::Plugin::RunmodeDeclare invocant => '$c';
<br><br><br>As for the order in which arguments are fetched, I don't mind swapping
<br>$self->param and $q->param in the fallback order. I don't have a practical use
<br>case either way. I only use $self->param in this context when CA::Dispatch
<br>puts url components there. I thought you might sometimes want to override a
<br>url component with a form field, but I haven't seen that happen yet.
<br><br><br>Method::Signatures now respects code attributes. I'm going to try and see if I
<br>can make it easier to reuse mschwern's code, so I don't have to copy/paste his
<br>stuff every time he changes something. I'd very much like to be able to use
<br>the same signature features.
<br><br><br>rhesa
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<br><br><p>From forum: <a href="http://www.nabble.com/cgiapp%40lists.erlbaum.net-f13613.html" embed="fixTarget[13613]" target="_top" >cgiapp@lists.erlbaum.net</a></p>tag:www.nabble.com,2006:post-19716920($self vs $c) was: Re: New Plugin: RunmodeDeclare2008-09-28T17:19:55Z2008-09-28T17:19:55ZMark StosbergOn Mon, 29 Sep 2008 00:18:02 +0100
<br>Richard Jones <<a href="http://www.nabble.com/user/SendEmail.jtp?type=post&post=19716920&i=0" target="_top" rel="nofollow">ra.jones@...</a>> wrote:
<br><div class='shrinkable-quote'><br>> Mark Stosberg wrote:
<br>> > As Rhesa proposed, he has followed through and released a plugin to add the
<br>> > Devel::Declare / Method::Signatures magic to CGI::Application:
<br>> >
<br>> > <a href="http://search.cpan.org/perldoc?CGI::Application::Plugin::RunmodeDeclare" target="_top" rel="nofollow">http://search.cpan.org/perldoc?CGI::Application::Plugin::RunmodeDeclare</a><br>>
<br>> Looks like an interesting alternative to CAP::AutoRunmode. One minor
<br>> irritant is having to put 'runmode foo ($c:)' everywhere (only if using
<br>> $c instead of $self of course). Might be useful to be able to declare
<br>> use CGI::Application::Plugin::RunmodeDeclare(invocant => '$c'), or just
<br>> use CAP::RunmodeDeclare qw($c).
</div><br>I agree with this sentiment.
<br><br>This brings back to life the discussion we were having on IRC the other
<br>day about "$self" vs "$c".
<br><br>I like "$c" because it's shorter and since it's used all over the code
<br>base, it's clear enough what it is. And, the first element to 'shift'
<br>off of @_ in a method must be the invocant.
<br><br>Michael Peters and Richardo argued in favor of "$self" citing the
<br>"Principle of Least Surprise" and the expectation that this non-standard
<br>change would generate more harm in confusion than benefits in
<br>keystrokes.
<br><br>Although I still prefer "$c" in my own code, I thought they made good
<br>points, so I switched back from "$c" to "$self" in the docs and code of
<br>the latest CGI::App dev release.
<br><br>But I'm interested in more opinions on the issue. Richard, do you
<br>particularlly prefer "$c", or were you mostly following along the docs
<br>that were updated to switch from "$self" to "$c" ?
<br><br> Mark
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<br><br><p>From forum: <a href="http://www.nabble.com/cgiapp%40lists.erlbaum.net-f13613.html" embed="fixTarget[13613]" target="_top" >cgiapp@lists.erlbaum.net</a></p>tag:www.nabble.com,2006:post-19716539Re: New Plugin: RunmodeDeclare2008-09-28T16:18:02Z2008-09-28T16:18:02ZRichard Jones-18Mark Stosberg wrote:
<br>> As Rhesa proposed, he has followed through and released a plugin to add the
<br>> Devel::Declare / Method::Signatures magic to CGI::Application:
<br>>
<br>> <a href="http://search.cpan.org/perldoc?CGI::Application::Plugin::RunmodeDeclare" target="_top" rel="nofollow">http://search.cpan.org/perldoc?CGI::Application::Plugin::RunmodeDeclare</a><br><br>Looks like an interesting alternative to CAP::AutoRunmode. One minor
<br>irritant is having to put 'runmode foo ($c:)' everywhere (only if using
<br>$c instead of $self of course). Might be useful to be able to declare
<br>use CGI::Application::Plugin::RunmodeDeclare(invocant => '$c'), or just
<br>use CAP::RunmodeDeclare qw($c).
<br><br>As an exercise I tried sub-classing it - 'use My::RunmodeDeclare' and
<br>overriding parse_proto(), substituting $c for $self in
<br>$signature{invocant}. It seems to work fine so far, and also works with
<br>CAP::AutoRunmode. Not tried it with CA::Dispatch yet though.
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<br><br><p>From forum: <a href="http://www.nabble.com/cgiapp%40lists.erlbaum.net-f13613.html" embed="fixTarget[13613]" target="_top" >cgiapp@lists.erlbaum.net</a></p>tag:www.nabble.com,2006:post-19709438[OT] Chaining menus using YUI2008-09-28T00:27:30Z2008-09-28T00:27:30ZRon SavageHi Folks
<br><br>I used this code
<br><a href="http://developer.yahoo.com/yui/examples/autocomplete/ac_states_jsarray.html" target="_top" rel="nofollow">http://developer.yahoo.com/yui/examples/autocomplete/ac_states_jsarray.html</a><br>to create a single autocomplete menu, and then an almost identical block
<br>of code, and their Ajax package, to chain another menu to the first
<br>(country menu => pick a country => states per country menu).
<br><br>However, after much editing, I've broken it :-(( so the second menu no
<br>longer displays.
<br><br>Anyone got some sample code I could copy?
<br><br>TIA.
<br><br>--
<br>Ron Savage
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<br><br><p>From forum: <a href="http://www.nabble.com/cgiapp%40lists.erlbaum.net-f13613.html" embed="fixTarget[13613]" target="_top" >cgiapp@lists.erlbaum.net</a></p>tag:www.nabble.com,2006:post-19707349Re: Question | Poll - Preferred ORM.2008-09-27T16:19:27Z2008-09-27T16:19:27ZRon SavageHi Porta
<br><br>On Sat, 2008-09-27 at 09:42 -0400, Perrin Harkins wrote:
<br>> On Sat, Sep 27, 2008 at 9:04 AM, Porta <<a href="http://www.nabble.com/user/SendEmail.jtp?type=post&post=19707349&i=0" target="_top" rel="nofollow">julian.porta@...</a>> wrote:
<br>> > Thanks to all for the feedback.
<br>> > It seems that, basically, it's between Rose::DB::Object and DBIx::Class.
<br>> > So far, RDO looks more like what I need, but a bit complex.
<br>> >
<br>> > Would you like to see a new ORM in cpan, more simpler?
<br>>
<br>> No. We have Class::DBI for that.
<br><br>Indeed - and many others, too many.
<br><br>It's very difficult to choose already, without spending a lot of time
<br>trying a few, and even harder for beginners.
<br><br>--
<br>Ron Savage
<br><a href="http://www.nabble.com/user/SendEmail.jtp?type=post&post=19707349&i=1" target="_top" rel="nofollow">ron@...</a>
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<br><br><p>From forum: <a href="http://www.nabble.com/cgiapp%40lists.erlbaum.net-f13613.html" embed="fixTarget[13613]" target="_top" >cgiapp@lists.erlbaum.net</a></p>tag:www.nabble.com,2006:post-19707025Re: Patches available for ::Plugin::Routes (was: Re: New plugin idea based/inspired on CA Dispatch)2008-09-27T15:32:32Z2008-09-27T15:32:32ZMark Stosberg<br>Today I noticed a related module that I missed when it was released
<br>about a year ago:
<br><br> <a href="http://search.cpan.org/perldoc?CGI::Application::URIMapping" target="_top" rel="nofollow">http://search.cpan.org/perldoc?CGI::Application::URIMapping</a><br><br>It also does dispatching with the ::Dispatcher syntax. I think I prefer
<br>the 'routes' approach, but I have a little trouble understanding the
<br>features of this 'URIMapping' module.
<br><br>There's a blog post to explain it further, in Japanese:
<br><a href="http://labs.cybozu.co.jp/blog/kazuho/archives/2007/11/cgi-app-urimapping.php" target="_top" rel="nofollow">http://labs.cybozu.co.jp/blog/kazuho/archives/2007/11/cgi-app-urimapping.php</a><br><br>Perhaps it's of interest to someone.
<br><br> Mark
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<br><br><p>From forum: <a href="http://www.nabble.com/cgiapp%40lists.erlbaum.net-f13613.html" embed="fixTarget[13613]" target="_top" >cgiapp@lists.erlbaum.net</a></p>tag:www.nabble.com,2006:post-19703666Re: Patches available for ::Plugin::Routes (was: Re: New plugin idea based/inspired on CA Dispatch)2008-09-27T08:25:40Z2008-09-27T08:25:40ZMark Stosberg<br>> Sorry, but I didn't understood this last sentence:
<br>> > The fix is to immediately the routes table when we call "routes" in
<br>> > setup, and register the run modes there, not each time we are in the
<br>> > pre-run callback.
<br><br>I'm sorry, my grammar was poor. I meant "immediately *process* the
<br>routes table when we call routes() in setup(). We'll register the run
<br>modes all at once there, instead of dynamically in the prerun()
<br>callback.
<br><br>Thanks for your continued work on this Julian!
<br><br> Mark
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<br><br><p>From forum: <a href="http://www.nabble.com/cgiapp%40lists.erlbaum.net-f13613.html" embed="fixTarget[13613]" target="_top" >cgiapp@lists.erlbaum.net</a></p>tag:www.nabble.com,2006:post-19703393Re: Re: Patches available for ::Plugin::Routes (was: Re: New plugin idea based/inspired on CA Dispatch)2008-09-27T07:53:37Z2008-09-27T07:53:37ZPorta-2On Sat, Sep 27, 2008 at 11:27 AM, Mark Stosberg <<a href="http://www.nabble.com/user/SendEmail.jtp?type=post&post=19703393&i=0" target="_top" rel="nofollow">mark@...</a>> wrote:
<div class='shrinkable-quote'><br>>
<br>>> 1. The plugin should be able to handle routes like
<br>>> '/runmode/:term/:term/:term' ? My first thought was that it should
<br>>> populate a array for the param 'term'. same applies for parameters
<br>>> passed by GET and POST with the same name (I cannot imagine a good
<br>>> reason for this, but completely possible) Any ideas?
<br>>
<br>> Dispatch.pm doesn't do this either, and no one has complained about the
<br>> omission of the feature so far. I agree that creating an arrayref of
<br>> values is how I would parse this case, but for simplicity I would
<br>> continue to omit the feature until someone makes a strong use-case for
<br>> "needing" it.
</div><br>Agree. definitely something can wait. Just was thinking.
<br><div class='shrinkable-quote'><br>>
<br>>> 2. Another thought I had is that, registering runmodes on the fly will
<br>>> cause those runmodes to not being available if there's no matching
<br>>> route, which may happen is the routes table is missing or incomplete
<br>>> or there's a error on the route itself and it doesnt match the url.
<br>>> It's true that if no route matches and no runmode is declared by the
<br>>> plugin, the application will fallback to it's default runmode and you
<br>>> can debug there to see what happened.
<br>>> Having the plugin registering runmodes on the fly it's nice, but I
<br>>> wouldn't push too hard inviting users to not registering their
<br>>> runmodes in the setup.
<br>>
<br>> This is an excellent point, Julian. I wasn't paying close attention and
<br>> didn't realize the run mode registration was dynamic. It should be
<br>> static. Dynamic registration created complications with AutoRunmode.
<br>> To work around it, we modified the 'Forward' plugin to detect that
<br>> AutoRunmode was in use, and then also did just-in-time registration
<br>> there! Not elegant.
<br>>
<br>> Here's a quick test which can be added to the test suite which will
<br>> confirm the need to use one-time static run mode registration:
<br>>
<br>> 1. Create a test module with two run modes declared via 'routes':
<br>> 'first' and 'second'. Do not declare 'run_modes' .
<br>>
<br>> 2. Have 'first' match and call "$self->forward('second')". Ideally this
<br>> should succeed, but I think it will currently fail.
<br>>
</div><br>Sorry, but I didn't understood this last sentence:
<br>> The fix is to immediately the routes table when we call "routes" in
<br>> setup, and register the run modes there, not each time we are in the
<br>> pre-run callback.
<br><br>> This was, we get static run mode registration in 'setup', while still
<br>> avoiding the need to also call 'runmodes' in most cases.
<br>>
<br>> Is that a patch you would be willing make? I could do it, but have some
<br>> other CPAN module maintenance I could be doing. Your help would be
<br>> appreciated.
<br><br>Definitely, I'll give it a try and ask for help if any problem.
<br><div class='shrinkable-quote'><br>>
<br>> Mark
<br>>
<br>> --
<br>> <a href="http://mark.stosberg.com/blog" target="_top" rel="nofollow">http://mark.stosberg.com/blog</a><br>>
<br>>
<br>>
<br>>
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