Hans Reiser found guilty of Murder.

[Jerry Feldman-2]

http://yro.slashdot.org/yro/08/04/28/2243232.shtml

Hans Reiser was found guilty of 1st degree murder yesterday. Hans
developed the ReiserFS journalling file system for Linux, that was the
standard for SuSE distros for a few years. I have not been following
this, but I am sure he will appeal.
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[Ben Holland]

Well I could look online but I could also ask here, any idea when ext4 will
be out? Is it out already? ~Ben

On Tue, Apr 29, 2008 at 10:44 AM, Jerry Feldman <gaf@...> wrote:

> http://yro.slashdot.org/yro/08/04/28/2243232.shtml
>
> Hans Reiser was found guilty of 1st degree murder yesterday. Hans
> developed the ReiserFS journalling file system for Linux, that was the
> standard for SuSE distros for a few years. I have not been following
> this, but I am sure he will appeal.
> --
> --
> Jerry Feldman <gaf@...>
> Boston Linux and Unix
> PGP key id: 537C5846
> PGP Key fingerprint: 3D1B 8377 A3C0 A5F2 ECBB  CA3B 4607 4319 537C 5846
>
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>

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[Mark Richards-3]

Jerry Feldman wrote:
> http://yro.slashdot.org/yro/08/04/28/2243232.shtml
>
> Hans Reiser was found guilty of 1st degree murder yesterday. Hans
> developed the ReiserFS journalling file system for Linux, that was the
> standard for SuSE distros for a few years. I have not been following
> this, but I am sure he will appeal.
Hans tried to explain why he hosed down his car after his wife's
disappearance saying that It was dirty... I thought cars had drain plugs
in the floor; why he removed one seat from the car: needed more room;
why his wife's blood was soaked into a sleeping bag: intercourse.  And
then there were the traces of blood in the house.

It's amazing how circumstantial evidence can support a criminal charge
with such a high standard of proof.

Was there not a friend who was allegedly boinking Ms. Riser (?) who
admitted to other murders. This rather sullies the broth and should have
raised some doubt as to his guilt (at least in my mind it would have).

How sad.  And then there are their children.  Motherless and now fatherless.

/m

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[Gordon Marx]

On Tue, Apr 29, 2008 at 11:49 AM, Mark Richards
<mark.richards@...> wrote:
>  Hans tried to explain why he hosed down his car after his wife's
> disappearance saying that It was dirty... I thought cars had drain plugs in
> the floor

When my car gets dirty, I use a vacuum cleaner, not a hose. Being a
moderately intelligent engineer, I know that unexpected water +
electronics = bad.

> why he removed one seat from the car: needed more room

He needed to get more room for sleeping by exposing the pointy bits
under the car seat?

>  How sad.  And then there are their children.  Motherless and now
> fatherless.

Won't someone please think of the children?

Gordon

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[Ted Roche-2]

On Tue, Apr 29, 2008 at 11:30 AM, Ben Holland <sheepskin505@...> wrote:
> Well I could look online but I could also ask here, any idea when ext4 will
>  be out? Is it out already? ~Ben
>

I see in the Fedora 9 release notes (real soon now) that est4 is
available as a "nearly feature complete preview" option, but it's
recommended for testing and evaluation, not production use.

Cite: http://docs.fedoraproject.org/release-notes/f9preview/en_US/sn-FileSystems.html#sn-Ext4-Preview

http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/FedoraExt4

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[John Abreau-2]

Mark Richards wrote:

> Hans tried to explain why he hosed down his car after his wife's
> disappearance saying that It was dirty... I thought cars had drain
> plugs in the floor; why he removed one seat from the car: needed more
> room; why his wife's blood was soaked into a sleeping bag:
> intercourse.  And then there were the traces of blood in the house.
>
> It's amazing how circumstantial evidence can support a criminal charge
> with such a high standard of proof.
>
> Was there not a friend who was allegedly boinking Ms. Riser (?) who
> admitted to other murders. This rather sullies the broth and should
> have raised some doubt as to his guilt (at least in my mind it would
> have).
>
> How sad.  And then there are their children.  Motherless and now
> fatherless.

I remember hearing rumors that the boinking friend was a cop, and that
he helped Ms. Riser plan a way to drop out of sight until after the
execution. She may be vacationing in the Bahamas with a fake ID
for all we know.

Of course, rumors are as unreliable as Fox News.


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[Gregory Boyce-3]

On Tue, 29 Apr 2008, Mark Richards wrote:

> Was there not a friend who was allegedly boinking Ms. Riser (?) who admitted
> to other murders. This rather sullies the broth and should have raised some
> doubt as to his guilt (at least in my mind it would have).

The Jury was apparently not allowed to hear about the other murders that
his former friend had committed.



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[garulbricht7]

Jerry Feldman wrote to <discuss@...> on Tue, 29 Apr 2008  at10:44 am
Regarding "Hans Reiser found guilty of Murder"
<http://yro.slashdot.org/yro/08/04/28/2243232.shtml>
by a so-called jury of his peers ...
>
>  Hans Reiser was found guilty of 1st degree murder yesterday. (4/28)
>  Hans developed the ReiserFS journalling file system for Linux, ...
>
>  I have not been following this,
> but I am sure he will appeal. (snip)

I likewise have not been following this real closely,
And I am sure Hans is a genius.

I am also comforted by the fact,
he can write code in prison while his appeal
is winding the way thru the court system...

may be he will come up with something evern greater than Reiser FS.

but genius or not, Hans made two big mistakes in my opinion,
because he didn't read the right books,
and he doesn't really understand the hearsay rules...

(The judge does .. the jury doesn't)

His mistakes were:

1.  Not waiving his so-called right to a jury, and

2.  Testifying in his own defense.

He should have just shut up -- and then the real rules of evidence take
over,
but he forgot:  "everything you do or say can be used against you in a
court of law."

So if nothing else: he is quilty of stupidity :(

Hope this helps,

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[Mark J. Dulcey]

Ben Holland wrote:
> Well I could look online but I could also ask here, any idea when ext4 will
> be out? Is it out already? ~Ben

ext4 is in the current kernel source, but is still considered under
development. No Linux distribution that I know of has yet adopted it as
its "native" file system; as somebody pointed out, Fedora 9 lets you
optionally install it. See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ext4

Given that this started as a thread on Hans Reiser, it's possible that
you really meant to ask about the fate of reiser4. That file system is
not part of the main Linux kernel sources; source code used to be
available on namesys.com while it was still up, but the state of the
code base is unclear given Reiser's legal entanglement. At least one
Namesys programmer is still working on it; see
http://chichkin_i.zelnet.ru/namesys/ See
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reiser4 for more background on reiser4.

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[Ben Holland]

Well that and I was being quite facetious. I mean, to be honest, I used
resier3 for a while on my gentoo box, thought it was nice... but unless
reiserfs ever gets put in say, the defaults for redhat/fedoria/ubuntu
grabbing traction is going to be really really hard. And now with the lead
developer who (can I say) killed his wife... Also all the dev's on ext3/4
and it's great stability and general all around awesomeness I don't see
reiser filling a need. ~Ben

On Tue, Apr 29, 2008 at 5:57 PM, Mark J. Dulcey <mark@...> wrote:

> Ben Holland wrote:
>
> > Well I could look online but I could also ask here, any idea when ext4
> > will
> > be out? Is it out already? ~Ben
> >
>
> ext4 is in the current kernel source, but is still considered under
> development. No Linux distribution that I know of has yet adopted it as its
> "native" file system; as somebody pointed out, Fedora 9 lets you optionally
> install it. See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ext4
>
> Given that this started as a thread on Hans Reiser, it's possible that you
> really meant to ask about the fate of reiser4. That file system is not part
> of the main Linux kernel sources; source code used to be available on
> namesys.com while it was still up, but the state of the code base is
> unclear given Reiser's legal entanglement. At least one Namesys programmer
> is still working on it; see http://chichkin_i.zelnet.ru/namesys/ See
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reiser4 for more background on reiser4.
>
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[Mark J. Dulcey]

Ben Holland wrote:
> Well that and I was being quite facetious. I mean, to be honest, I used
> resier3 for a while on my gentoo box, thought it was nice... but unless
> reiserfs ever gets put in say, the defaults for redhat/fedoria/ubuntu
> grabbing traction is going to be really really hard. And now with the
> lead developer who (can I say) killed his wife... Also all the dev's on
> ext3/4 and it's great stability and general all around awesomeness I
> don't see reiser filling a need. ~Ben

reiserfs does have some advantages. Even the existing version (reiser3)
outperforms ext2,3,4 on directories with a lot of files, so it's a good
choice for (say) a mail server using maildirs or an NNTP server. reiser4
extends that advantage and adds space efficiency for small files by
packing multiple small files into a single disk block. That's not as big
a deal as it used to be now that disk space costs 20 cents per gigabyte,
but it could matter if you were trying to implement a WinFS-like vision
of file system as the ultimate database. Finally, reiserfs doesn't have
a fixed inode limit; you don't have to worry about configuring your file
system correctly for the mix of files you expect to have, it's all
automatic. The defaults for extN are reasonable for many systems, but on
a mail server you run out of inodes before you run out of space, and on
a media server you waste a bunch of space unnecessarily on inodes you
won't use.

reiser4 appears to be dramatically faster than existing file systems at
some operations. It is also slower at some others, so as usual it helps
to know what the expected usage of a file system is before making your
choice.

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[Jerry Feldman-2]

On Wed, 30 Apr 2008 13:02:00 -0400
"Ben Holland" <sheepskin505@...> wrote:

> Well that and I was being quite facetious. I mean, to be honest, I used
> resier3 for a while on my gentoo box, thought it was nice... but unless
> reiserfs ever gets put in say, the defaults for redhat/fedoria/ubuntu
> grabbing traction is going to be really really hard. And now with the lead
> developer who (can I say) killed his wife... Also all the dev's on ext3/4
> and it's great stability and general all around awesomeness I don't see
> reiser filling a need.

Personally, I would rather see development go into improving ext2/3/4
as well as cluster file systems. IMHO, reiserFS4 will never go out the
door since Namesys is virtually defunct, and there are a few developers
hanging on.

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[Ben Holland]

Well I mean, you wouldn't use a file system like XFS or JFS for a mail
sever, you CAN but by and large you won't. I can see very specific cases
where different file systems are great, I mean, they were built... however
if I were able to configure the number of inodes on ext3 I think I would
rather use that then resier by and large. just my opinion though. ~Ben

On Wed, Apr 30, 2008 at 2:09 PM, Mark J. Dulcey <mark@...> wrote:

> Ben Holland wrote:
>
> > Well that and I was being quite facetious. I mean, to be honest, I used
> > resier3 for a while on my gentoo box, thought it was nice... but unless
> > reiserfs ever gets put in say, the defaults for redhat/fedoria/ubuntu
> > grabbing traction is going to be really really hard. And now with the lead
> > developer who (can I say) killed his wife... Also all the dev's on ext3/4
> > and it's great stability and general all around awesomeness I don't see
> > reiser filling a need. ~Ben
> >
>
> reiserfs does have some advantages. Even the existing version (reiser3)
> outperforms ext2,3,4 on directories with a lot of files, so it's a good
> choice for (say) a mail server using maildirs or an NNTP server. reiser4
> extends that advantage and adds space efficiency for small files by packing
> multiple small files into a single disk block. That's not as big a deal as
> it used to be now that disk space costs 20 cents per gigabyte, but it could
> matter if you were trying to implement a WinFS-like vision of file system as
> the ultimate database. Finally, reiserfs doesn't have a fixed inode limit;
> you don't have to worry about configuring your file system correctly for the
> mix of files you expect to have, it's all automatic. The defaults for extN
> are reasonable for many systems, but on a mail server you run out of inodes
> before you run out of space, and on a media server you waste a bunch of
> space unnecessarily on inodes you won't use.
>
> reiser4 appears to be dramatically faster than existing file systems at
> some operations. It is also slower at some others, so as usual it helps to
> know what the expected usage of a file system is before making your choice.
>
>
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[David Hummel-2]

On Wed, Apr 30, 2008 at 2:32 PM, Jerry Feldman <gaf@...> wrote:
> On Wed, 30 Apr 2008 13:02:00 -0400
>  "Ben Holland" <sheepskin505@...> wrote:
>  > Also all the dev's on ext3/4
>  > and it's great stability and general all around awesomeness I don't see
>  > reiser filling a need.
>  Personally, I would rather see development go into improving ext2/3/4
>  as well as cluster file systems. IMHO, reiserFS4 will never go out the
>  door since Namesys is virtually defunct, and there are a few developers
>  hanging on.

There are clear technical reasons why one would want to consider
running ReiserFS/Reiser4 instead of ext3/4.  Regardless of the status
of Namesys and its associated developers, Reiser is open source, and
if the need exists, the project will be continued by other interested
developers...

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[Ben Holland]

ext3/4 is also open sourced.... and has a huge percentage of market share,
and has a huge proven track record.... and....

On Wed, Apr 30, 2008 at 3:31 PM, David Hummel <lemmuh@...> wrote:

> On Wed, Apr 30, 2008 at 2:32 PM, Jerry Feldman <gaf@...> wrote:
> > On Wed, 30 Apr 2008 13:02:00 -0400
> >  "Ben Holland" <sheepskin505@...> wrote:
> >  > Also all the dev's on ext3/4
> >  > and it's great stability and general all around awesomeness I don't
> see
> >  > reiser filling a need.
> >  Personally, I would rather see development go into improving ext2/3/4
> >  as well as cluster file systems. IMHO, reiserFS4 will never go out the
> >  door since Namesys is virtually defunct, and there are a few developers
> >  hanging on.
>
> There are clear technical reasons why one would want to consider
> running ReiserFS/Reiser4 instead of ext3/4.  Regardless of the status
> of Namesys and its associated developers, Reiser is open source, and
> if the need exists, the project will be continued by other interested
> developers...
>
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[David Hummel-2]

On Wed, Apr 30, 2008 at 4:37 PM, Ben Holland <sheepskin505@...> wrote:
> ext3/4 is also open sourced.... and has a huge percentage of market share,
> and has a huge proven track record.... and....

Yes of course, in fact all I use is ext3.  I'm merely stating that
there are sound technical reasons for choosing Reiser4/ReiserFS, and
because it's free and open source, it will not die along with Namesys
as long as there is demand for it:

http://chichkin_i.zelnet.ru/namesys/

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[darose]

Mark J. Dulcey wrote:

> reiserfs does have some advantages. Even the existing version (reiser3)
> outperforms ext2,3,4 on directories with a lot of files, so it's a good
> choice for (say) a mail server using maildirs or an NNTP server. reiser4
> extends that advantage and adds space efficiency for small files by
> packing multiple small files into a single disk block. That's not as big
> a deal as it used to be now that disk space costs 20 cents per gigabyte,
> but it could matter if you were trying to implement a WinFS-like vision
> of file system as the ultimate database. Finally, reiserfs doesn't have
> a fixed inode limit; you don't have to worry about configuring your file
> system correctly for the mix of files you expect to have, it's all
> automatic. The defaults for extN are reasonable for many systems, but on
> a mail server you run out of inodes before you run out of space, and on
> a media server you waste a bunch of space unnecessarily on inodes you
> won't use.

I also like reiserfs for the exact reason you mention above.

One very important - and often overlooked - negative about reiserfs,
though:  the support tools suck!  I've probably had 3 or 4 separate
occasions where my reiser fs got damaged, and when I attempted to fix
the problems using reiserfsck (which, IIRC, explicitly warns you that
it's experimental) it trashed the file system even more, resulting in
losing a lot of data.

Since then I've been trying to restrict myself to only using reiserfs
for things that benefit from its strengths - i.e., apps that require
large numbers of files, lots of small files, lots of fast i/o, etc.

Word to the wise ...

DR

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