7A2-99B Reference guide suggestion

[Andrew Vayanis]

Hey all,

I am new to this list, but I was encouraged to share my thoughts in  
case they might end up being helpful.  I'd like to preface that what I  
am about to say is somewhat of a rant because I can't come up with a  
clear way to organize my thoughts on this situation, yet I still  
believe I have a valid point.

Anyhow, after spending a little time looking at other frameworks and  
their documentation I realized that the current docs aren't very  
newbie friendly.  Even though there is a quickstart guide and it helps  
in setting up a bootstrap, explaining a bit about MVC, and using the  
Zend_Form component, I don't really think the documentation is very  
intuitive as a whole.  Looking at the documentation for the  
Zend_Controller, for instance.  Zend_Controller encompasses many key  
components of an application, yet anyone new to MVC and even ZF might  
not know to look at the Zend_Controller documentation to figure out  
how to rewrite URLs.  Nor might they realize that the Zend_Controller  
is the real entry point for an application.

I am not sure what the best way to remedy this is, but I think it  
would be highly beneficial and useful, for the documentation to have a  
step by step guide into creating a basic, yet somewhat complex  
application.  Sure it isn't a full stack framework, but a classic,  
"how to create a blog in x minutes" might be a useful tutorial or even  
screencast.

Anyhow, those are my 2 cents,

Andrew

P.S. - I decided to express my thoughts after referring ZF to several  
friends/colleagues of mine who came back a bit confused and perplexed  
about how to go about using the framework.  I am sure they could all  
figure it out after some reading, but I think many people want a  
quick, easy way to get up and running with the least amount of reading  
possible.

[Mike Roetgers]

There are a lot of tutorials created by the ZF-Community which are filling this gap (e.g. http://akrabat.com/zend-framework-tutorial/).
So I don't see a real reason for the doc-team to invest resources into that.

Just my cents. :-)

Kind regards
Mike Roetgers

Andrew Vayanis wrote:

Hey all,

I am new to this list, but I was encouraged to share my thoughts in  
case they might end up being helpful.  I'd like to preface that what I  
am about to say is somewhat of a rant because I can't come up with a  
clear way to organize my thoughts on this situation, yet I still  
believe I have a valid point.

Anyhow, after spending a little time looking at other frameworks and  
their documentation I realized that the current docs aren't very  
newbie friendly.  Even though there is a quickstart guide and it helps  
in setting up a bootstrap, explaining a bit about MVC, and using the  
Zend_Form component, I don't really think the documentation is very  
intuitive as a whole.  Looking at the documentation for the  
Zend_Controller, for instance.  Zend_Controller encompasses many key  
components of an application, yet anyone new to MVC and even ZF might  
not know to look at the Zend_Controller documentation to figure out  
how to rewrite URLs.  Nor might they realize that the Zend_Controller  
is the real entry point for an application.

I am not sure what the best way to remedy this is, but I think it  
would be highly beneficial and useful, for the documentation to have a  
step by step guide into creating a basic, yet somewhat complex  
application.  Sure it isn't a full stack framework, but a classic,  
"how to create a blog in x minutes" might be a useful tutorial or even  
screencast.

Anyhow, those are my 2 cents,

Andrew

P.S. - I decided to express my thoughts after referring ZF to several  
friends/colleagues of mine who came back a bit confused and perplexed  
about how to go about using the framework.  I am sure they could all  
figure it out after some reading, but I think many people want a  
quick, easy way to get up and running with the least amount of reading  
possible.

[wllm]

Actually, this is exactly what the quickstart guide is supposed to
address:
http://framework.zend.com/wiki/display/ZFDEV/Official+ZF+QuickStart.
Currently it is blocked on me, and I've been very disappointed that I
haven't been able to get back to it since I began before 1.5. I'm
looking in to options to unblock it, but I also have some extra time
coming up this next week which I should be able to devote to this.
Also, the CLI project that Ralph is currently introducing will address
what we call the "first hour problem".

,Wil

> -----Original Message-----
> From: Mike Roetgers [mailto:mike@...]
> Sent: Friday, May 30, 2008 2:29 AM
> To: fw-docs@...
> Subject: Re: 7A2-99B Reference guide suggestion
>
>
> There are a lot of tutorials created by the ZF-Community which are
> filling
> this gap (e.g. http://akrabat.com/zend-framework-tutorial/).
> So I don't see a real reason for the doc-team to invest resources into
> that.
>
> Just my cents. :-)
>
> Kind regards
> Mike Roetgers
>
>
> Andrew Vayanis wrote:
> >
> > Hey all,
> >
> > I am new to this list, but I was encouraged to share my thoughts in
> > case they might end up being helpful.  I'd like to preface that what
> I
> > am about to say is somewhat of a rant because I can't come up with a
> > clear way to organize my thoughts on this situation, yet I still
> > believe I have a valid point.
> >
> > Anyhow, after spending a little time looking at other frameworks and
> > their documentation I realized that the current docs aren't very
> > newbie friendly.  Even though there is a quickstart guide and it
> helps
> > in setting up a bootstrap, explaining a bit about MVC, and using the
> > Zend_Form component, I don't really think the documentation is very
> > intuitive as a whole.  Looking at the documentation for the
> > Zend_Controller, for instance.  Zend_Controller encompasses many key
> > components of an application, yet anyone new to MVC and even ZF

might
> > not know to look at the Zend_Controller documentation to figure out
> > how to rewrite URLs.  Nor might they realize that the
Zend_Controller

> > is the real entry point for an application.
> >
> > I am not sure what the best way to remedy this is, but I think it
> > would be highly beneficial and useful, for the documentation to have
> a
> > step by step guide into creating a basic, yet somewhat complex
> > application.  Sure it isn't a full stack framework, but a classic,
> > "how to create a blog in x minutes" might be a useful tutorial or
> even
> > screencast.
> >
> > Anyhow, those are my 2 cents,
> >
> > Andrew
> >
> > P.S. - I decided to express my thoughts after referring ZF to

several
> > friends/colleagues of mine who came back a bit confused and
perplexed

> > about how to go about using the framework.  I am sure they could all
> > figure it out after some reading, but I think many people want a
> > quick, easy way to get up and running with the least amount of
> reading
> > possible.
> >
> >
>
> --
> View this message in context: http://www.nabble.com/7A2-99B-Reference-
> guide-suggestion-tp17552569p17554978.html
> Sent from the Zend Doc mailing list archive at Nabble.com.